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The soldiers gripe

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  • The soldiers gripe

    One of the things the US GI has developed to an art form has been the GI gripe. Whether it is complaining about the food, officers, current political situation, the weather or just life itself the American soldier has developed the gripe to an artform. My own reading and research has placed the beginning of this trend in time memorial. I have read several letters and one diary that have reassured me that the men of 61-65 knew how to grouse.

    Part of my interest comes from the fact that one of the the men I portray apparently had quite the mouth on him and had developed the gripe to an artform. Enough so that it would appear that may have been one reason he was shuffled from one Regiment to another. Something fairly rare for an enlisted men, even an NCO.

    My reading has been restricted primarily to the Union side of the line, I've often wondered how common the gripe was on the other side of the firing line; I'm tempted to say it was more common just from looking at the desertion rates, though I'm not certain that would be a valid measure.

    I wonder if any particular Regiment, both Union and CSA had the record, if you will, for the growls and gripes etc. Many officers were unpopular, but I wonder who was griped about even in other Regiments or Brigades.

    It's one thing I rarely if ever see at a Living History or re-enactment; nobody gripes. I never hear the: "Lt Col Mickey Mouse is such a worthless liar they should give him back the money he used to buy his rank; he isn't worth the..." etc. Is this just because it is an unknown quantity or is there some other reason?

    I guess I'd just like to know how many of you out there do the "GI gripe." And how does one improve their "gripe."
    Johan Steele aka Shane Christen C Co, 3rd MN VI
    SUVCW Camp 48
    American Legion Post 352
    [url]http://civilwartalk.com[/url]

  • #2
    Re: The soldiers gripe

    Boy I guess you haven't been around us. We have a number of former active duty members or still on AD and we gripe all the time. I figured that a soldier's life never really changed nor his attitude so whether it was 1863 BC, 1863 AD or 2004, "if you ain't bitchin', you ain't happy."

    s/f

    DJM
    Dan McLean

    Cpl

    Failed Battery Mess

    Bty F, 1st PA Lt Arty
    (AKA LtCol USMC)

    [URL]http://www.batteryf.cjb.net[/URL]

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: The soldiers gripe

      Dan's post pretty much covers the topic. The average men who made up the armies, north and south, were pretty of similar cut and I am sure that if a guy in the Federal Army was complaining about something there was another one complaining about the same thing across the line in the Confederate Army.

      As for complaining at events, I have heard plenty over the years. I don't think it is something that is being left out.

      Jim Kindred
      CW4, US Army
      Jim Kindred

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      • #4
        Re: The soldiers gripe

        If "Troop" aint bitchin'...........something is wrong..........

        Comment


        • #5
          Griping Reb.

          In my opinion, one of the most accomplished gripers in the CS army was Robert Patrick. Read "Reluctant Rebel: The Secret Diary of Robert Patrick 1861-1865" edited by F. Jay Taylor. This guy b**ched about many people and things. Since he wrote his diary in code (hence "secret"), he was very candid, and sometimes quite naughty (VD references, lust for 14 year-old girl in Sunday School class, etc.). His diary is priceless 'cause it's completely unsanitized.
          [SIZE=1]Neal W. Sexton[/SIZE]

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          • #6
            Re: The soldiers gripe

            Neal,

            if you could get me a copy of that it would be cool. What unit was he in? If the troops ain't bitchin' you ain't workin' them hard enough.

            John Sweeney

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            • #7
              Re: The soldiers gripe

              Gallant Sween: He was in the 4th LA, but got himself detailed to the QM dep't (after an unpleasant experience at Shiloh, I think). A "cushy" job apparently just gave him more time to b**ch, but I admire this quality in him, as it makes him seem more like one of "us" rather than one of "them" from the past.
              Send me a private e-mail w/ your address.

              Neal
              [SIZE=1]Neal W. Sexton[/SIZE]

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              • #8
                Re: The soldiers gripe

                My favorite gripe was from a Florida man who said of his commander "He ain't fit to haul guts to a bear".
                Dusty Lind
                Running Discharge Mess
                Texas Rifles
                BGR Survivor


                Texans did this. Texans Can Do It Again. Gen J.B. Hood

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: The soldiers gripe

                  I saw a post on another forum that brings out another version of this that I can somewhat confirm.

                  The poster mentioned that Aristophanes was a general and Socrates a trained hoplite. His point was that men who spend a large portion of their lives training to face death (or in the case of citizen-soldiers, actually facing it) develop a philosophical nature.

                  In the same vein, I can tell you that I have had few decent conversations beyond work-related issues since getting out of the infantry. Why, I don't know.
                  Last edited by ; 07-02-2004, 12:01 PM.

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                  • #10
                    Re: The soldiers gripe

                    The quantity of complaining is proportional to the amount of hardships we face during an event. A longer march, less or poor food issued, bad weather, poor leadership, etc all cause more griping. But, these are REAL soldier experiences and thus the griping becomes an enhancement to my reenacting experience.
                    Also, comraderie also seems to be better built when facing some hardships (even if they are just for a weekend in a controlled environement).

                    Regards,
                    Jim Butler
                    The SRR
                    Jim Butler

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: The soldiers gripe

                      I think complaining gets into the first person issue.

                      If your feet hurt, you're hot, hungry, out of water or been moved by a new officer who took took 9 drill moves when an experienced officer would have used only 3 then a soldier would be complaining.

                      To complain just to be complaining really sounds forced and faked.

                      Also, most reenacting privates tend to act out far longer than they should.

                      An experienced private from any age knows just how far he can push the line with his conduct. When a sergeant "cuts you the eye" and gets ready to say something the experienced private knows it's time to shut up, step back and pull the hat down low on his head.

                      Jim Peterson
                      A Rowdy Pard
                      Jim Peterson
                      Rowdy Pards

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: The soldiers gripe

                        Comrades,

                        Jim Peterson hit's the mark square on. The complainant who gets the high marks is the one who knows how to express what everyone else is feeling, at just the right time, and with just the voice. He's well enough in tune with his NCO's to know when NOT to complain or let lose a "comment" , and also is skilled enough to disguise from where and by whom the "comment" comes. Oh, his Orderly Segeant probably knows his voice all too well, but has a hard time catching the fellow in the act. The OS will probably have a "chat" with the fellow at a later time, or see to it that certain details are made available for him to accomplish or participate in. However, if the "comments" are representative of everyone in the ranks, then odds are the NCO will be a little more reasonable in his talk with the complainant. or perhaps not:)
                        A good leader will know which comments to let slide. After all, the complaint is the soldier's safety valve. Muzzle it and you're asking for trouble.
                        respects,
                        Tim Kindred
                        Medical Mess
                        Solar Star Lodge #14
                        Bath, Maine

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: The soldiers gripe

                          I have to add my two cents on this one. I've been in an artillery battery from the 3rd PVLA for the past 3 1/2 or 4 years now, and one thing I know for certain is that the guys know how to complain. If the troops in 1861 or 1865 complained about officers, than this is one thing that is done correctly in my unit. RARELY is there an event where someone isn't complaining about something done. I just pray to God that I don't become an officer or nco in this unit anytime soon. :D Better to be the one complaining than to be the one having to hear all the complaining about you.

                          N. Keen
                          Battery B, 3rd PVLA
                          "Battery B, where the B stands for Bitching"
                          [FONT=Palatino Linotype][COLOR=Black]Nicholas A. Keen
                          Cannoneer Battery B, 3rd Penna. Artillery
                          "When our boys went about the citizens they seemed surly and unaccomadating and showed no disposition to grant us any favors, for which I could not blame them because the soldiers I know to be a great nuisance"- Robert Patrick "Reluctant Rebel"
                          [url]http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/armysystem.php?do=recruit&uniqueid=37[/url]
                          Harper's Weekly May 4 1861: "War they have invoked; war let them have; and God be the judge between us."

                          "There is nothing so exhilarating in life as to be shot at without effect."

                          - Winston Churchill





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