Are you ready for some Football!?!

[Pvt_Jack_Bauer]

Getting ready for work this morning I was listening to Civil War Journal on the History Channel. The episode pertained to life of a common soldier. During the episode it talked of the different games soliders would play during camp and baseball I knew but then they started to talk about football. They showed some artists drawings of regiments playing and the historians describing how the men would really go at it during these games. From some initial research I can tell that it was some type of hybrid between rugby and the amercanized version we know today. Does anybody have any other information. I would love to make a period ball to the take to some events this summer and get some games going on. Thanks

[boozie]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

We had a whole thread on this before the "Big Crash". I had the same question after reading Benjamin Scribners "How Soldiers Were Made". In Chapter 2 (p.36) he states "As one means of diverting the minds of the men at this time, I ordered a large foot-ball which would be hurled among the men then assembled so as to arouse in them some intrest in life."

There were some very good posts on the game known as football at the time. Wish we could get all of that input back. It was more of a rugby type game, if I recall correctly.

Respectfully,

[Chris Suppelsa]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

Is it possible he is talking about soccer?

[boozie]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

I think soccer was brought up also, but the word hurl means to throw with force.

Hope we get some of the people who posted on the old thread to repost their information.

Respectfully,

[Justin Runyon]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

That's what I initially thought, and that may still be a possibility. The fact that the quote says "Hurled" the ball (given that he really means what he says) would sort of rule out soccer.

I confess very little knowledge on sports or sports history though.

[BrownBlanketMess]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

All,

I would recommend checking out the Professional Football Researcher Association website. It has a wealth of information behind the origins of what we call American Football. www.footballresearch.com Article of interest "No Christian End: The Beginnings of Football in America by PFRA Research
Might want to try and find the book, "The Journey to Camp: The Origins of American Football from ancient times to 1889" by Bob Braunwart and Bob Carroll. Sometimes lighthearted 53 pages of basic history.

Just a few notes from what I can remember from a college course I took on American sports history and supported by articles through the PFRA, by the later part of the 18th Century football had found its way onto college campuses. Princeton played a version called "ballown" by 1820 and Harvard, Yale, and others each had individual variations. At Harvard, "Bloody Monday" took place on the first Monday of each new college year, starting in 1827.

From what I have found the game was played with a mixture of both "soccer" and "rugby" These college games at one point became so destructive that Yale abolished the game in 1860 when officials in New Haven complained. Harvard did the same that year.

New England schoolboys took on the game it seemed as colleges began to ban them. From the article "No Christian End" it describes the ball as such, "the ball was handmade by someone's father, but, if the boys were lucky, they might have one of the store-bought rubber balls that had been introduced in 1855. These allowed for more accurate kicking, and as the use of them spread, they encouraged soccer-like games over rugby styles. These schoolboy gatherings were quite informal, but "buddies" tended to hang together and set teams sometimes were developed."

The Oneida Football Club was formed in Boston in 1862. They combined their favorite features of both soccer and rugby. Goal kicking and running with the ball developed into what they call "The Boston Game."

Again, there is a wealth of information provided on the PFRA site that it should answer most questions.

I'm curious to know what the orginal ball looked like being that it was introduced in 1855? Does anyone know if Canton Ohio has one of these early models on display?

Steve LaBarre
Brown Blanket Mess
Hodge Podge Mess
WIG

[toptimlrd]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

I recall the thread and there was a period photograph of a game in camp where you could see the elongated shape of the ball which was similar to a modern American football or rugby ball which would preclude it from being what we in America call soccer. I wish I could recall the details of the game, but there was quite a discussion on it before the crash.

[Pvt_Jack_Bauer]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

Thanks everybody for their input. I am trying to find some good images or at least some descriptions of how the ball would have been constructed. If anybody has anymore information please pass it along, Thank you.

[jpbab]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

"Roots of American Football
The birth date of football in the United States is generally regarded by football historians as November 6, 1869, when teams from Rutgers and Princeton Universities met for the first intercollegiate football game. In those early games, there were 20 players to a team and football still more closely resembled rugby than modern football.

The game of football has a history of constant rule changes. Rule changes have been implemented to bolster the excitement of the game of football and to increase the game's safety."

circa 1912 http://www.footballlegends.org/images/hectorbrooks.gif

Meanwhile, Across the Atlantic
American colonists played similar football-type games. By the mid 1800s, colleges in the United States were challenging each other to games of football. In November 1869, some 100 fans watched Rutgers and Princeton play what might be considered the first college football game. Players were allowed to kick, hit or dribble the ball. Throwing the ball or running it was prohibited. Trivia buffs will want to know that Rutgers won that first game 6-4.

sounds like soccer with an oblong ball that you can use your hands as long as you don't grab the ball. dribbling an oblong ball would be quite comical.

[Jeff Prechtel]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

Frederick Remington did some drawings of football players
in the 19th century. I believe they were supposed to represent
his team mates, and possibly himself, when he played at
Harvard during the 1870s. I would surmise that the rules
for football then, as well as ball specs would be somewhat
similar to the 1860s. If you can find those drawings they
may help you out visually. I believe they are published in the
book "Frederick Remington and his Art" by Fred Renner.

[Moose]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

As a college rugby player I have done some reading on the topic. From what I understand, "football" was a loose term used to describe the game played with a ball that was kicked. Usually before each match the two team Captains would get together and establish the rules for that particular match, as there were no standard rules for the game. The idea of "rugby" which is actually called "Rugby Football" (I'm going to pass over the legend of how the game was created), was called "rugby football" because that was the style of "football" played at the Rugby School in England. The date of when "football" came about I do not know, but "rugby football" was given as 1823. Given all this, I feel persoanlly, that American Football, Rugby Football, Soccer, Irish Football, and Aussie Rules Football, are all dirived from the same form of Football of long ago. Each differed in style and exectuiton of the game, but all related.

In short -- If one wanted to portray a football match at a living history, it would be up to you on how to play the match. As for the different types of "football," that is really more of a disscussion on British Imperialisam and it's Colonies rather than something for the ACW.

Cheers,
Joseph Caridi
POC'R Boys Mess
Captain, VCU RFC

[Virginia Mescher]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

Does anybody have any other information. I would love to make a period ball to the take to some events this summer and get some games going on. Thanks

The book, _The American Boy's Book of Sports and Games_ (1864) has a chapter with rules and illustration on foot-ball. The rules are described as "The laws of foot-ball, as played at Rugby." I'm not a sports person so I can't interpret the rules. But reading the English version of the same book, Rugby rules of foot-ball allow the use of feet and hands while Eaton and Westminster rules of foot-ball only allow the use of the feet.

Balls were made of either a ox bladder filled with air and covered with leather or India rubber and netted. No dimensions were given.

I have 1855 (English), 1864 (American) and 1868 (English) editions of this book and the illustraions are all different. In the 1855 edition the ball looks like a soccer ball, in the 1864, the ball is just large and dark, and in the 1868, the illustration is in color and the ball again large and dark. The 1864 edition has the most extensive explanation of the rules of the game but the least amount of history of the game.

We carry the book on our web site in Books, 19th century reproductions. It is now out of print but we do have several copies left in stock but when they are gone, we can not order more.

[Ken]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

Could this be a little football fun in camp?

[boozie]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

I think you just hit a grand slam Ken. Great image!!!!!:D

[paulcalloway]

Re: Are you ready for some Football!?!

Beautiful - fellar on left is getting ready to boot that thing into the next county.

I count three ghost images - two behind the kicker and one to the far right. Lots of movement going on to produce that effect.

Where'd you find that image, Ken?