Firing on the move: Infantry in line

[RJSamp]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

The cites were specifically for a regiment in battle line. This isn't street fighting, skirmishers, or a column of companies or any tactical evolution that you've seen in a period manual. The cites were specifically about Confederate infantry regiments in line of battle.....and were something like the "always awe inspiring sight of infantry units firing while on the move. A sign of a truly veteran infantry regiment."

Rather than halting, you fire at will (fire by file always was fire on your own crook) while on the move. Basically you are trying to 'beat down' or suppress your opponents fire while closing the interval and moving through the beaten zone as fast as possible. Marching Fire....Fire while Advancing. Something that would be a lot easier to do with repeaters (Wilder was going to form a Brigade square at Chickamauga and literally blast his way over to Snodgrass Ridge and rescue Thomas).

The opposite of this would be to load and not cap your weapon and try to close with the bayonet. Which seems to be the predominant Federal tactic, even with Upton's experiments.

There would have to be some slowing down of the individual to 'aim' the rifle....and there was a natural movement from rear to front rank of the loaded weapons. Think of ranks of soldiers at a stone wall or field fortification....you fire from the front, and load from the rear.

Early's sharpshooter regiment's most certainly fought like this in 1864 at Monocacy Junction and Ft. Stephens (north side of Washington City). Am sure other units employed it, including Federal.

And I've never seen it 'reenacted'

[Charles Heath]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

RJ,

What you describe was commonly seen at reenactments in the mid-to-late '90s. The last time I saw this used on the field was at Laurel Hill in 1997, although it has been included in drill several times since then. Well drilled groups should have no trouble doing this.

[RJSamp]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

Cool Beans. Unfortunately I've never seen either the AOP or Mifflin Guard do this.....regiment plus size units that, IMHO, are well drilled. Maybe we need to have a decent Selma, Monocacy, Fort Stedman, or more 1864ish+ battles (Payne's Farm, Bentonville, Raleigh, Wilson NC) where these tactics (letting men fire on the move on their own volition) might have been employed.

No any upcoming events in the next couple of years that will feature this?

Thanks!

[Rob Weaver]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

I think we're talking about two or three things simultaneously here. First is skirmishing, which is not what RJ had in mind. The second is street fighting. Ditto. Third there is firing by a defending force, stacked up in 3 or 4 ranks. As I understand it, the rear ranks load and pass muskets forward, empties coming back to the rear again. I'm thinking of Confederates at the Stone Wall, and Federals on the Muleshoe. This is obviously not on the move, although the last example is certainly a force on the offensive. We bump into a reenactor problem here; I don't know a lot of people who want to mix their musket up with dozens of other people's muskets in the midst of a firing demonstration. Then there's firing and moving at the same time. The line keeps going forward, while men fire and load independently. This is possible, and no more unsafe than independent fire in 2 ranks stationary. An awareness of the people around you, and willingness to talk with your comrades in arms will keep you from shooting off the side of someone's face, or deafening them. I'd like to practice it before actually doing it, but it seems plausible.

[Charles Heath]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

RJ,

Like the Mifflin Guard, these fellows were well drilled mainstreamers; however, they did have a dual impression back in the days before that was en vogue. Fact is, about the only aspect I really remember was the whole process worked much better when the knapsacks and blanket rolls were dropped. Remember the days when folks would cut 13" sticks for training aids at COIs, and the last pair to drop their spacer while marching were the winners? That was about the same timeframe. It worked. We never had an accident, but we were fortunate no one had a cookoff either. The latter would have burned more than just the firer's hands and face depending on the direction of the muzzle. Loading while moving is typically problematic, and would be even more so with live rounds instead of just blanks.

No any upcoming events in the next couple of years that will feature this?

"Know" I don't, but there is always the possibility someone will revive this practice. :)

[Silas]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

Interesting discussion. Such tactics would require a little coordinated drill and practice before it can be used safely and expeditiously. Assuming folks are willing to take the time do perform it properly, isn't the use of such a tactic akin to wearing jaguar pants? Just because it's a kewl thing to do doesn't mean it's appropriate for every scenario.

I also see some implementation problems where small companies are employed and some obvious problems involved in narrowing a battalion front by half on a open field. Under the right circumstances, such a tactic could be useful, but I don't see that particular tool coming out of the tool box very often.

Others needs for fun tools will certainly vary.

[JStiles]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

I believe RT Coles, the Adjutant of the 4th Alabama, mentions in his book "From Huntsville to Appomattox" that he observed firing on the move done only twice during the war. I believe the battles he mentions were Sharpsburg and Chancellorsville........Jerry Stiles

[7thNJcoA]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

I was reading some of shermans after action reports from atlanta and he speaks of ordering to fire on the move to cover his troop movement from the smoke so the enemy wouldnt be able to take steady aim. This was a common used tactic ecsp the last two years after the armies learned that standing and fighting in the open was not the way to go hence trench warfare and fighting from cover like tree lines.

[RJSamp]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

Interesting discussion. Such tactics would require a little coordinated drill and practice before it can be used safely and expeditiously. Assuming folks are willing to take the time do perform it properly, isn't the use of such a tactic akin to wearing jaguar pants? Just because it's a kewl thing to do doesn't mean it's appropriate for every scenario.

I also see some implementation problems where small companies are employed and some obvious problems involved in narrowing a battalion front by half on a open field. Under the right circumstances, such a tactic could be useful, but I don't see that particular tool coming out of the tool box very often.

Others needs for fun tools will certainly vary.

Didn't mean to convey that this tactic was used in every battle by every unit in the war. It would have to be in a battle of manuever.....have to be performed by Veteran regiments.....so no earlier than say May 1863 Chancellorsville. And no 100 day Ohio Militia units. We know Early's boys did it at both Monocacy and Fort Stephens....and have read other quotes about it.
I think if we keep our minds open during our readings we'll find many more examples of it......Wofford's brigade as they went up the slopes of Little Round Top might be a good one to look at..... Chickamauga may have some examples. John Otto (21st Wisconsin) talks about two or three volleys before ramming an attack home, but these all appear to be from a stationary position. How about the attack on Fort Stedman?

[1stMaine]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

Comrades,

From: A Volunteer's Adventures by John William De Forest. Yale University press, 1946.

In recounting the first engagement of the 12th Connecticut Infantry, in Louisiana, 27 Oct. 1862, pp 56-69 inclusive:

"...an aide had instructed the Twelfth Connecticut to throw off knapsacks, leave two companies in charge of the baggage train, and hasten to the battlefield."

"...Looking southerly, we noted the Eighth New Hampshire coming toward us in double column, ready to form square against cavalry. As we pushed on into the fields, marching tranquilly by the flank, an aide rode up with orders.
"Colinel, General Weitzel's compliments. He says the Eighth will be on your left; you will move more to the right and give it room to deploy. Then you will front southwards, throw out skirmishers, and follow them in line of battle. Beyond the wood is an open field. You will cross that, and drive the enemy from his position."

" There was a general feeling of relief, akin to delight, when the lieutenant colonel's clear mettalic voiced pealed out "Halt! Fire By File! Commence Firing!"
The men could not wait to fire by file, which is a graduated discharge running from right to left of each company; they leveled those 500 rifles tugether and sent a grand, crashing, volley into the hostile line of smoke which confronted them; for as yet we could see no other sign of an enemy."

At this point, the regiment began to advance, under orders, yet two companies threw themselves flat when the regiment behind them was ordered to lie down. They quickly rose up and dashed after their comrades. Ed

"In great haste we ...sprang up and recovered our place in line. It was the last stop or pause in our advance. We had been drilled long enough under fire, and we broke away from the Lieutenant Colonel. Once he tried his utmost to make us halt, dress the line and give a volley, as the regulars are said to do in battle. But he might as well have ordered a regiment of screeching devils to halt. On we swept in the tooth of cannister and musketry, every man loading and firing as fast as possible. There was such a pressure inward towards the colors that some of my lightweights were crowded out of their places, and we were three ranks deep instead of two.
... The swearing mania was irrepressible. In the excitement of the charge it seemed as if every extremity of language was excusable, provided it could help towards victory. ..... I did not exhort my soldiers to fight gallantly and fire coolly. They were fighting the best they knew how, and aiming as well as the quick-step would permit. nearly all that I said might be summed up as repetitions of "close up!" and "Guide Right!"....

-----------------

There is a great deal more, including dressing under fire with the company guides stepping out, facing centre, and holding the muskets upside down, etc. Wonderful detailed stuff taken from the letters he wrote to his wife. Highly reccomended for everyone to read, and especially for those who portray a company officer, as his accounts of his kit, quarters in the field, and daily duties and responsibilities are quite enlightening.

Respects,

[Bob 125th NYSVI]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

Regardless, his tactic is basically done in the column formation - the men "front" while staying in their fours. The first man fires and moves to the back of the file, the other three men move up. The man who has just fired reloads while the second man fires. Second man moves to the rear, third man moves up... and so on.

Paul while I don't know the specific section of the manual, I have done this and was told it was a tactic designed for fighting in streets in towns or cities when a unit can't deploy into a line.

[Bob 125th NYSVI]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

After reading through everything I can't help but wonder if the descriptions given by participants are incomplete.

To have a unit fire while "moving" may not indicate that the unit actually moves as it fires. It may just refer to a unit throwing out a volley, immediately continuing it's advance (or retreat) while loading and then stopping to fire again.

If you think about it, you can't do - at the ready, aim and fire - while moving. That sequence really requires the firing unit to be stationary and fairly well in formation to use.

But suppose the unit was advancing, loading on the go and stopping for a second or two without guiding or dressing to throw out another volley and then immediately resuming its advance.

Wouldn't that leave the impression of a unit firing on the go without the chaos created by trying to pass one line through the other to fire while at the same time simultaneously advancing on the enemy. It just seems to me that the act of exchanging line positions on the go wouldn't be worth the loss of momentum to the advance.

[1stMaine]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

Bob,

In De Forest's account of the 12th Ct in action, he indicates that they were loading AND firing while advancing, each man at his best speed, not any sort of volley, etc.

.....On we swept in the tooth of cannister and musketry, every man loading and firing as fast as possible.

And..

.....They were fighting the best they knew how, and aiming as well as the quick-step would permit. nearly all that I said might be summed up as repetitions of "close up!" and "Guide Right!"....

This is also very close to the accounts of Hood's men advancing while firing at Gettysburg on July 2nd.

It seems to me a case of "fire at will" while adving upon the enemy's position. Certainly it's quite possible yo do exactly that, especially with files opening up while moving, loading, firing, etc. As De Forest says, he basically was reduced to going along with his company, and repeating the commands to "close Up!" and "Guide Right!"

Later on in the book, De Forest intimates that in other battles, this sort of fighting style on both sides seems to be more common than what the public imagines a battle to be like. His unit is exceptionally well-drilled, and they spend a great deal of time doing drill, when not on campaign, and he talks about how the 12th's drill allows them to easily maneuver about the field as if a well-oiled machine. And yet, after the initial volley, when any sort of command to advance is given, the officers are basically along for the ride, as the regiment goes into a sort of automatic, reflexive motion, advancing, firing, etc, until a decision is reached between them and their enemy.

Respects,

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

I'm no expert on tactics, but a couple of thoughts come to mind reading this.

I believe John Jackman at one point describes his regiment as deployed in "line of battle, single file" in which case they could have functioned essentially as skirmishers with compressed intervals. His and other accounts lead me to wonder whether or not they're describing a variety of improvised formations that simply aren't covered in anyone's manuals. The idea gets some support from Ardant du Picq's description of infantry fire, and the after action reports he includes in "Battle Studies."

Further support for the idea of less structured formations that would enable an advancing fire comes from the 1846 Prussian manual for fusiliers armed with the Dreyse, where a line goes into skirmish order on the command "Schwarmen!" -- basically the guide just runs a directed distance out to the flank and the men take rough intervals with no reference to front number twos, rear number ones, or the like. I also find it interesting that contemporary instructions for cavalry skirmishers seem to just tell the men to spread out to cover a given front.

Apparently American the military leaders were just not quite ready to formally release the infantry from the scripted drill that had developed over the centuries, though a skilled tactician could get pretty creative (think of Elisha Hunt Rhodes' description of how he moved his regiment forward at Opequon under fire).

It all leads me to believe that firing on the move by infantry in line can mean a whole lot of things, but drill and discipline would still be essential for safety, and so that the unit didn't degenerate into a mob.

As for Willich's special formation, it sure would be neat to know exactly what he did. In the recent "August Willich's Gallant Dutchmen" ( http://www.amazon.com/August-Willich.../dp/0873388623 ), his advance at Shiloh is described as a column of companies doubled on the center, with two companies in advance as skirmishers. When the skirmishers were stopped by concentrations of Confederates, the column deployed into a line of battle, ejected the enemy with their fire, then ployed back and continued the advance. They repeated this manuever several times. Although it was conventional, it took a pretty well drilled unit to actually carry it out under fire.

[davidf]

Re: Firing on the move: Infantry in line

Reading through this, this reminds me of when we did a sort of street fighting technique on railroad tracks. We were in a two file column, one on each side of the track and the two front men would fire, then withdraw to the rear while loading, and then the next two men would fire, and then so on and so on. Is there a period manual somewhere that explains "street fighting" like this? Also, how often would loading on the move occur during the war besides those two times mentioned above in other posts?