Enlisted African Confederates

[LWhite64]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

Just a few things to think about, first of all the word soldier, if you are looking for combat soldiers, you may not find anything, if you are looking for cooks, teamsters, musicians, etc, then there should be evidence. Also, beware of the numbers that get thrown around. Also check out, Confederate Emancipation by Bruce Levin and What This Cruel War was over by Chandra Manning.

Lee

[boreguard]

Re: African American Re-enactors

That's true Dale, Company K of the 16th Louisiana Infantry Volunteers had a "free man of color" in their ranks from St. Landry Parish !
Dennis Neal

[BrettKIllinois]

Re: African American Re-enactors

re: "( 1 )Why is our endeavour basically Caucasian based?
( 2 )How can that be changed to really reflect everyone's history?"

IMHO
1. I think it is easier for Caucasians to glorify and escape into the 1860s. Where-as non Caucasians can easily look at this period as just one step in a process that even today hasn't been completed. The enslavement of Blacks may have legally ended in 1865 in this country, but it certainly did not end the struggle for equality which many could argue is still going on today. And because this struggle is not yet over, it would seem irrational to spend your free time recreating and glorifying the past when there is still much work to be done today.

2. It would take a strong will for someone to be excited to spend their money and free time to be a slave for a weekend. As many Blacks during the CW found themselves in laboring roles and this would be the most common place you would see them in many battles, there is much more appeal in being a soldier than someone's slave. The mere idea of this seems crazy considering many people no matter what race feel enslaved by their jobs Monday through Friday. It would take a lot of motivation for me to leave after work Friday, drive 5 hours, on my own dime, to be someone else's slave/laborer on Saturday and Sunday, and then back at it on Monday. IMHO that's not a hobby, to me that's masochism.

But, my hat goes off to all Blacks who do take on these roles, it is important to teach others that yesterday wasn't "the good old days" Yesterday isn't a pretty picture. So much of our history when it comes to slavery seems sugar coated to me, so the "slaves" at Williamsburg and other places, my hat is off to you for portraying these difficult roles and full fill the need for this history to be created.

To some it up, it's hard enough to be a soldier, and sometimes that feels like being a laborer.


-Brett

[NC5thCav]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

Franklin Cozzens is listed as a private in the 37th NC, KIA at 2nd Manassas. He and his brother enlisted in the Confederate army in Boone, Watauga County NC. He is listed on the 1860 census as a literate, property owning mulato. I beleive that would qualify.

[Mtn.Guerilla]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

To all,

I'm currently taking a grad course at university in MD, and earlier this week a professor, who has had a long stint in the African American History section of the library of congress, tried to tell me that I was incorrect when I remarked that the south used blacks as soldiers. She said that has never been any evidence of an African being enlisted in the southern army.

Now I know in March 1865 general order #14 authorized the raising of African American companies for use in the southern army, but that the war ended before they could be offically put into a battle. Where I need some help from you guys is that I'm hoping somebody has come along some research (morning reports, perhaps a muster roll, or even better enlistment papers) that clearly shows an African (who is enlisted) in the ranks of the southern army.

So far the only thing I've found is the info on general order #14, some brief mentioning of black confederates in William H Freehling's book "The South vs. The South", and that is really about it. So, if you've got some info please shoot me an email. I need info to be detailed, and at the very least please be able to cite where you got the information from.

My email address is jared_byrnes@hotmail.com

In doing some research on this particular subject, I came across this great website with multiple links to historical references to blacks in the confederate army, book resources, and a lot of really great information.

http://www.37thtexas.org/html/BlkHist.htm

[LWhite64]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

Just be careful of the sources, check their sources. Looking over the 37th's site, I noticed several errors, the statement from John B. Gordon about all of the troops being for enlisting slaves as soldiers is just wrong. Some did support the idea, but there was a whole lot that were fiercely against it. Once again check the books I refered to earlier, Confederate Emancipation and What This Cruel War War Over.

Lee

[jmbyrnes]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

I agree with Lee. I've come across this site, but had questions about the information. Keep in mind I'm dealing with a lady who has spent 40 years in the LOC, so I need primary document info that can't be argued. It's rather annoying that she is pressing her agenda, and her information is less than truth. After sitting in class with her this week it's very apparent that she refuses to believe something if the documentation doesn't exist in the LOC.

[Kevin Hall]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

It might be worth your time to contact the Sons of Confederate Veterans HQ in Tenn. A few years back if I remember correctly they had a big push to document and recognise black confeds in an effort to dispute the concept that they were a racist organization. I have since thrown the magazine away that featured the story concerning their efforts and recognition of the decendants but I'm sure their national HQ would have it on file.

Kevin Hall

[33rdaladrummer]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

It's been reprinted in several books, including the Portraits of Conflict series. Though attributed to Arkadelphia, conventional thought at this time points to this being the Hempstead Rifles in Washington, Arkansas, in May of 1861.

Tom,

Could you tell us which book in the series you are referring to?

Thanks,

[Tom Ezell]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

It might be worth your time to contact the Sons of Confederate Veterans HQ in Tenn. A few years back if I remember correctly they had a big push to document and recognise black confeds in an effort to dispute the concept that they were a racist organization. I have since thrown the magazine away that featured the story concerning their efforts and recognition of the decendants but I'm sure their national HQ would have it on file.

The two books listed above came from a portion of that research, and are commonly marketed in SCV magazines and related venues.

The Confederation is much more into "heritage" than "history" these days, so I would strongly urge you to use the citations and seek confirmation of the claims by checking the original sources as much as possible.

[33rdaladrummer]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

I was really only interested in obtaining a copy of the book because it contained the photograph you had posted. I was not as much interested in the black soldier as the drummers in front.

[boreguard]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

Eric Holt Collier a slave once owned by Thomas Hinds of Mississippi, the famous bear killer and hunting guide for Teddy Roosevelt of which the Teddy Bear fame arose, recieved a Confederate Pension and his application was signed by many a white officer and fellow soldier who served with him and witnessed him fighting...he was not a body servant.
Referance the book "Holt Collier, his life, his Roosevelt hunts, and the origin of the Teddy Bear" by Minor Ferris Buchanan.

One great book and laced with inumerable quotes by Holt himself.
Bully for un-revised history !
Dennis Neal

[ewtaylor]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

I think in the Official Records of the War of the Rebellion, Gov. Harris of TN called for all freemen of color to enlist (1861).
Here is a website for CS Colored soldiers:

http://www.angelfire.com/wi/Carver/csaaa.html

There is plenty of info out there. The Union Army practiced segregation, but the CS Army took all and they fought side by side. I think the SCV has exagerrated the numbers, but there is no way of knowing for sure.

everett taylor

[Clsinclair]

Re: African American Re-enactors

Em,


How many people do you think really know about the Trail of Tears and the Indian relocation programs of the early 19th century?

Of course I could go on, but Em..you summed it very nicely.

The Eastern band of Cherokees puts on a good out door drama in Cherokee, NC regarding the Trail of Tears. The area settlers protected them during the Trail of Tears. Kind of ironic that I now live on the same track of land that was owed by Dr. James Crawford, who delivered Andrew Jackson and later AJ lived there with the Crawfords. Mrs. Jackson was a sister of the Dr's wife.

To get to the point of your post, we were never taught about the Trail of Tears in history. I had to learn on my own. What is really sad is that the original Indian Trail AKA Old Wagon Road runs through my property and it was plowed over. A neighbor is filling in what he thinks is a gully on his property. I told him what he was doing and he could not give a rip.

Claude Sinclair
Lancaster, SC

[jchristiansen]

Re: Enlisted African Confederates

The whole issue of black Confederates and of the attitudes of enslaved African-Americans to their owners is extremely complex and I would urge anyone approaching this topic to approach it with an open mind and with the mindset that everything you think you know is very likely wrong on some level. A few points:

1. I would suggest taking Mr. White's observations to heart. Many African-Americans did recieve pensions for non-combat roles (although it could be argued that they often performed these tasks under fire or in hazardous conditions). A pension does not necessarily mean a black Confederate who enlisted for the cause. Consider that many large slaveholders may have hired-out the labor of some of their slaves to the Confederate army; in other cases, slaves were conscripted for use in constructing entrenchments and other tasks. I took a transcription of just such a slave who was sent to help repair Ft. Sumter during the siege - it's very good. I can post it later - it's on my home computer.

2. Consider the possible bias, political agenda or other motive of any source material about Afro-Confederates, particularly websites. Mr. Hall's post on the SCV is a good example. It's pretty easy to take a few facts and spin them to tell any story you want - just look at the history of American politics.

3. An added complication is the racial heirarchy that was practiced within African-American society. Mulattoes, quadroons, octaroons and other "mixed-race" people with lighter skin tones - frequently free blacks in the South, especially New Orleans - often held themselves above and apart from darker skinned blacks. There were several companies of mulattoes in Mobile and New Orleans that offered themselves for Confederate service at the outbreak of the war, but were rejected (a case where the CS army did not "take all" and fight "side by side"). In New Orleans, they ultimately entered Federal service as the Corps de Afrique, or the Louisiana Native Guards, and fought at Port Hudson.

As far as the original question of why aren't there more African-American reenactors, military or civilian, it may have something to do with the crisis that many elements of African-American society are facing, many of which could be argued still stem from the legacy of the Civil War and Reconstruction. Crime, poverty, and unemployment are rampant among young African-American males. In the light of these current problems, recreating the past may not be a high priority, especially considering the expense of the hobby.

-John Christiansen
PLHA