Imbecile

[Gary of CA]

What were the standards, if any, for a surgeon to declare a person an imbecile? I know that the standards to become a "surgeon" were very unregulated. One could either attend a medical school or apprentice under a practicing doctor. Even the 19th century medical schools' cirriculum weren't anything to brag about.

The closest I've found were some competency tests conducted on Ellis Island, but those tests were conducted long after the Civil War.

From one who wallows in ignorance, thanks in advance.

[ley74]

Re: Imbecile

I am glad you placed this in the "Sinks" and not the "Authenticity" folder.

[Charles Heath]

Re: Imbecile

Gary,

Phil Campbell may be of some help, as "Benji" is in his quiver of characters. His email is TeamsterPhil@aol.com

[markj]

Re: Imbecile

For starters, try looking at the records and reports of the New York State Asylum for Idiots (yep, that is what it was really named!) established, it appears, in 1851.

Here are some links that should give you some leads:

http://www.upstate.edu/medalumni/alumni_resources/su06alumjournal/su06psychiatry.pdf

http://www.rootsweb.com/~asylums/idiot_ny/index.html

I may be able to find some other journal articles that can answer your question, so feel free to contact me privately and I'll send whatever I find:

markj@purdue.edu

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[Hank Trent]

Re: Imbecile

What were the standards, if any, for a surgeon to declare a person an imbecile?

Here's a discussion about imbecility in connection with examining potential recruits, published in 1864 for issue to medical officers of the US Army:

http://books.google.com/books?id=IfnPkidNIoAC&pg=PA17

It continues on the next page with more detailed discussion on the varying degrees of intelligence found within imbecility.

In general, an "idiot" was more mentally impaired, while an "imbecile" was less so.

From page 20: "Idiocy, Cretinism, Imbecility, and Dementia are, usually, easily enough recognized by want of harmony and vacuity in the expression, obvious deficiencies of mind, imperfect development of body, ill habits, limited but imperious instincts, and various hallucinations and delusions."

During the actual examination, on page 172, the author says the recruit "should be tested as to the functions of hearing, of speech, and of sight, and as to the state of his intellectual faculties... The whole contour of the head and the expression of countenance should be observed, to detect the physiognomy of epilepsy, imbecility, or insanity."

I know that the standards to become a "surgeon" were very unregulated. One could either attend a medical school or apprentice under a practicing doctor. Even the 19th century medical schools' cirriculum weren't anything to brag about.

Not sure what you're implying... that there maybe existed a precise method of testing, but most doctors with their poor education were unaware of it? Or that doctors were poorly educated and thus unable to develop a precise method of testing?

The concept of relying on standardized tests just wasn't around, so there wasn't a push for that kind of diagnosis. The doctor's judgment based on his observation and conversation with the person would have been considered acceptable.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

[Gary of CA]

Re: Imbecile

Not sure what you're implying... that there maybe existed a precise method of testing, but most doctors with their poor education were unaware of it? Or that doctors were poorly educated and thus unable to develop a precise method of testing?

Hank, I wasn't implying anything. Unlike today with its high degree of standardization, Civil War era medical credentials was not regulated (though a surgeon in the Union Army was examined by a board to test his knowledge) and I agree with you that standardized testing wasn't around then (as it is today). BTW Hank, thanks for the link, it's terrific!

What I was looking for was how a Civil War surgeon would determine the competency of an individual before declaring said individual an imbecile.

Thank you to everyone who responded. I'll go swallow my blue pill and follow up on those links and look forward to some interesting reading.

[TeamsterPhil]

Re: Imbecile

Charles has overestimated the amount of primary source research that has gone into my portrayal of "Benji C." He was developed for the Land Betwen the Lakes event in 2006 as a result of finding a 40 yr old male "idiot" listed in the 1860 Stewart County, TN census. The specifics of his impression are based on several years experience at transporting/interacting with developmentaly disabled adults in my "real life" job. An integral part of my portrayal of Benji is the availablity of "Benji's mother" or other suitable reenactor.

Phil Campbell
Benji might be back in 2008

[Spinster]

Re: Imbecile

Tending Benji is definitly a full-time job----made none the easier by Phil's spot-on imitation of the small inconsistencies that mark a man-child. I live in an area of with a number of group homes, and must often make the transition from my world to theirs when talking with my neighbors.

I'd love to see more direct quotes from that book---I'm wondering if Benji as interpreted fits more in the Idiot or Imbecile slot for the period.

Benji is easily distracted, constantly curious, ever loving and helpful unless someone gets in his way, can do basic chores if he doesn't get distracted, and obeys authority figures--provided they treat him right.

I've considered 'belling' Benji so I could find him easily when he wanders off. I gave up on putting apron strings or a walking harness on him, as he is a foot taller than I am. He's appeared at Land Between the Lakes, a real handful in that wilderness, but was much easier to manage in the confines of the Town of Perryville. Especially after the Provost brought him back from conscription, and told him to take care of the women. He took that job very seriously.

While not knowing Gary's need for this particular definition, I do agree that any attempt at interpreting a person of less functioning mental capacity requires a second party to function as 'keeper'--whether that be ageing Mother, or a brother in the ranks. Sometimes that little extra narrative prompt is required for other players to figure out what the heck is going on.

Proud to be Benji Compson's mother--- anytime, anywhere,

[Gary of CA]

Re: Imbecile

From the link provided by Hank Trent, pages 17-20:

“The term imbecility of mind is usually employed by writers on the subject of enlisting soldiers, and intended to apply to Idiocy, Imbecility, and Dementia, rather than to the higher types of Insanity. Idiocy is a congenital condition; Cretinism, although not to be diagnosed usually at birth,is hereditary; Imbecility is a minor degree of mental deficiency than idiocy; and Dementia is the result of diseased action supervening upon a healthy mental state, or a sequel of more acute forms of mental derangement. In the lower forms of idicoy the functions of animal and organic life are greatly impaired: the idiot is below the plant, and is scarcely alive to external impressions. Cretinism is not frequently seen in this country; and it is scarcely necessary to enter into a description of it. Hitherto it has existed mainly in Switzerland, Valais, Savoy, Italy, and Piedmont, where it is endemic; but it is also sporadic, “an occasional case being found, presenting the characteristics of genuine Cretinism, in the cities of various countries.” A very well-marked case is not in the Fort Schuyler General Hospital. Imbecility of mind is a term admitting of wide application. From the highest to the lowest order of mental soundness there are an infinite number of degrees of intelligence. The same variations are found in mental deficiency. It is not always easy, in a given case, to determine whether the intelligence is, or is not adequate to the performance of military duty. In the lower forms, imbeciles produce nothing, and all their movements, both intellectual and moral, are aroused only by impulses from without. They reply correctly; but they must not be asked too many questions, nor required to make responses which demand reflection or are contrary to their habits. Other display considerable shrewdness, and are constantly indulging in jokes: they pass for half-witted people, whose droll behavior and ready repartees created amusement. Imbeciles possessing this degree of intelligence may perform the duty of soldiers, as far as it is merely mechanical, with exactness, but they are, of course, unfitted for any duty requiring discretion or judgment. They are, moreover, preculiarly liable to insane impules to commit theft and other crimes, although competent to the performance of many of the ordinary duties of life and able to take care of themselves.... Idiocy, Cretinism, Imbecility, and Dementia are, usually, easily enough recognized by want of harmy and vacuity in the expression, obvious deficiencies of mind, imperfect development of body, ill habits, limited but imperious instincts, and various hallucinations and delusions.”

I suppose it's an interview by the surgeon who then determines fitness for service. This of course is dependent on the surgeon's interview skills, perceptiveness of the person's pattern of speech/body language to determine truthfulness. I recall where one Union soldier faked being an idiot (pretended he was fishing - on land and without a pole) to get his discharge and after receiving it, snapped back into his normal state and joyfully returned home.

I would think the Confederates surgeons did the same, but was there an equivalent Confederate manual to the one cited by Comrade Trent? I believe the Confederates would have availed themselves to anything they captured.