Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

[NMVolunteer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

If it was not renamed in 1865, why would it be renamed in 2018? That sounds like an extreme form of hyperbole.

[Dale Beasley]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

It is hard to take any of your points seriously when you refer to the effort to save monuments as a "whine cellar" and belittle a majority of living historians who oppose this movement as a "self-selected" group. -- Eric Tipton

there should be a "Thumbs up' or a "HOOAH" or suggested earlier a "Like " button.

[teufelhund]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

I oppose the removal of the monuments. To me, the reason the monuments are being removed only now 150 years after the fact is that history has been rewritten by ignorant people and/or others for political gain. This is only one part of the bigger problem.

[allan4570]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

I oppose the removal of the monuments!

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

The war is over, the country is reunited, and Confederate history is American history.

'Nuff said.

Is “'Nuff said” a challenge, Johnny? :)

Confederate history is indeed American history, but statues aren't history.

It's not as if a barbarian pulverizing the stela with all the glyphs in the temple square could destroy the entire recorded history of our civilization. We have these things called “books” (and I don't mean the works of Thomas DiLorenzo).

Statues are public statements from those who raised them to those who pass them by. Many of the ones covered under the broad term “Confederate monuments” were raised by people celebrating a rebellion of white slaveholders and are now repugnant to the citizens, black and white, who have to look at them as they go about their daily lives.

I think local citizens should have some say in what public statements they want to make and what they want to look at. I don't think the AC has any great standing to interfere in that.

If you and others want to personally interfere in the culture wars of today, go ahead. But don't co-opt an organization that, so far as I know, was established and has heretofore operated as a historical organization, not a contemporary political one.

Why is that too much to ask?

[john duffer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

Is “'Nuff said” a challenge, Johnny? :)

Confederate history is indeed American history, but statues aren't history.

It's not as if a barbarian pulverizing the stela with all the glyphs in the temple square could destroy the entire recorded history of our civilization. We have these things called “books” (and I don't mean the works of Thomas DiLorenzo).

Statues are public statements from those who raised them to those who pass them by. Many of the ones covered under the broad term “Confederate monuments” were raised by people celebrating a rebellion of white slaveholders and are now repugnant to the citizens, black and white, who have to look at them as they go about their daily lives.

I think local citizens should have some say in what public statements they want to make and what they want to look at. I don't think the AC has any great standing to interfere in that.

If you and others want to personally interfere in the culture wars of today, go ahead. But don't co-opt an organization that, so far as I know, was established and has heretofore operated as a historical organization, not a contemporary political one.

Why is that too much to ask?

By "rebellion of white slaveholders" are you talking about Washington, Jefferson, et al?

Apparently 80% of this "organization" are in favor of acting as an historical organization and 20% a contemporary political one. Why are people on the AC not allowed to have an opinion unless it agrees with yours? I don't want historical monuments torn down period. If that means I'm stupid I don't care, that's my opinion and sorry if it disappoints you.

[NMVolunteer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

Adams and Hamilton were slave owners?

[Tyler Underwood]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

Confederate history is indeed American history, but statues aren't history.

Isn't that like saying that the statue of David, The Great Buddha, or the Statue of Liberty is not history?

[john duffer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

Adams and Hamilton were slave owners?

Beats me, I could Google it for you. "et al" means "and others" not "and everybody else".

[NMVolunteer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

At any rate, it is a false comparison. Nothing in the Declaration of Independence calls specifically for the protection of slavery.

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

Isn't that like saying that the statue of David, The Great Buddha, or the Statue of Liberty is not history?

"David" is art, the "Buddha" is a religious object, and the Statue of Liberty is a statement of public values so no, they may have a history, but they aren't one. It's not a very useful analogy for the kinds of monuments currently in the news.

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

By "rebellion of white slaveholders" are you talking about Washington, Jefferson, et al?

Apparently 80% of this "organization" are in favor of acting as an historical organization and 20% a contemporary political one. Why are people on the AC not allowed to have an opinion unless it agrees with yours? I don't want historical monuments torn down period. If that means I'm stupid I don't care, that's my opinion and sorry if it disappoints you.

I think you've got what the percentages mean reversed. In any case, as I said earlier, the poll presents a false dichotomy.

And I don't think you're stupid, John. But I do think you and others are being insensitive to the views that sparked the honest discussions taking place in cities like Baltimore and New Orleans, and boxing yourselves into an inflexible position that's unnecessary in the short term and untenable in the long one.

[Tyler Underwood]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

"David" is art, the "Buddha" is a religious object, and the Statue of Liberty is a statement of public values so no, they may have a history, but they aren't one. It's not a very useful analogy for the kinds of monuments currently in the news.

Actually two of the aforementioned are listed as part of the top ten most visited statues in the world, the other is of the top ten most visited in Japan. :)

[NMVolunteer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

"David" is art, the "Buddha" is a religious object, and the Statue of Liberty is a statement of public values so no, they may have a history, but they aren't one. It's not a very useful analogy for the kinds of monuments currently in the news.

And the statues in the South (at least the big equestrian statues of Lee and Davis and others in middle of cities), for historical context, were defiant statements by Unreconstucted people, placed as challenges to the federal government and the freedmen.

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

And the statues in the South (at least the big equestrian statues of Lee and Davis and others in middle of cities), for historical context, were defiant statements by Unreconstucted people, placed as challenges to the federal government and the freedmen.

Who arranged for the placement of these statues?
Who were the primary donors?
What was the stated purpose of the statue at the time it was put in place?

Correlation does not equal causation. Let's not lean on post hoc ergo propter hoc, please.