Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

Thanks for the clarification Michael, looks like 94 to 20 at present

Even I wouldn't vote the negative on this question. Or the positive. As I said earlier it presents a false dichotomy. It completely ignores individual cases and context. Saves thought, but doesn't address the issues.

[john duffer]

Never mind

I was just scrolling through TV programing and clicked on a Military History Channel program - THE CIVIL WAR IN COLOR and the description mentioned it covered "The American Civil War For Equal Rights".

[Michael Semann]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

To those who support the rape of our Southern history and heritage through the destruction of our monuments, flags etc., either actively or through ambivalence, I must say that I now have a total lack of respect for you. You are also failing to see the enormity of this travesty, and the much wider scope this activity will assume. It won't stop with the South, rather it will continue to sweep the nation like a cancer, as it is already beginning to do. Unchecked, it is only a matter of time before YOUR heroes are similarly attacked and vandalized, rest assured.

[john duffer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

To those who support the rape of our Southern history and heritage through the destruction of our monuments, flags etc., either actively or through ambivalence, I must say that I now have a total lack of respect for you. You are also failing to see the enormity of this travesty, and the much wider scope this activity will assume. It won't stop with the South, rather it will continue to sweep the nation like a cancer, as it is already beginning to do. Unchecked, it is only a matter of time before YOUR heroes are similarly attacked and vandalized, rest assured.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

To those who support the rape of our Southern history and heritage through the destruction of our monuments, flags etc., either actively or through ambivalence, I must say that I now have a total lack of respect for you. You are also failing to see the enormity of this travesty, and the much wider scope this activity will assume. It won't stop with the South, rather it will continue to sweep the nation like a cancer, as it is already beginning to do. Unchecked, it is only a matter of time before YOUR heroes are similarly attacked and vandalized, rest assured.

A few thoughts occur to me whenever I see a statement like this.

First, "our Southern history" covers a lot more ground than one side of a tragic four year conflict and, if used accurately. "our" covers many more southern people than I think you may have had in mind.

Second, I don't worry too much about monuments to "my" heroes suffering. Most of those heroes don't have monuments, and it's not too difficult to figure out why.

And I can appreciate the feelings that underlie the perhaps unintentional trivializing of words like "rape" and "cancer"in your argument, but I'm also pretty sure I can also get my without your respect.

- - - Updated - - -

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

Speaking of trivializing, I can well imagine Pastor Niemoller's reaction to the use of his poem in the context of statues to Judge Taney and the Liberty Square perps...

[john duffer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

Speaking of trivializing, I can well imagine Pastor Niemoller's reaction to the use of his poem in the context of statues to Judge Taney and the Liberty Square perps...

Hey, if you can know exactly what all immigrants were thinking 150 years ago I can know exactly what the Pastor would or wouldn't mind.

[NMVolunteer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

Since there is debate over whether Niemöller was wanting to protect minorities or was just nationalist but anti-Nazi, it is possible that he would sympathize with the White League that put up the Liberty Square memorial.

[Michael Semann]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

And I can appreciate the feelings that underlie the perhaps unintentional trivializing of words like "rape" and "cancer"in your argument, but I'm also pretty sure I can also get my without your respect.

- - - Updated - - -

That is a good thing, because you certainly don't have it. I think as little of your ramblings as you apparently do mine.

[Michael Semann]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

Exactly. You correctly surmise that this destructive phenomenon is far more profound than simply saving a marble or bronze statue. Many apparently can't seem to see that far.

[NMVolunteer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

Here is something I noticed from my SCV days, regarding the people most vocal over Heritage Defense regarding the plethora of statues and things named after Forrest and Davis. They tended to break down into the following: roughly 74% said "my family, right or wrong"; roughly 24% said things weren't as bad as non-Southern historians claimed; and roughly 2% secretly agreed with Forrest and Davis, but would not admit to it in public because of the strange looks they received. The camp adjutant was an unabashed white supremacist. I was one of a few in the camp who were not born in the South, because it was in the Atlanta area and people after the Civil War had a habit of traveling and marrying outside of their home states. Some of us did not feel particularly comfortable at meetings, because we were interested in genealogy and military history, and not some of the other aspects of the SCV. That is what I have seen here and on other online forums that have discussed the monuments; participants do not seem to realize that their heroes are seen as villains by others.

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

Here is something I noticed from my SCV days, regarding the people most vocal over Heritage Defense regarding the plethora of statues and things named after Forrest and Davis. They tended to break down into the following: roughly 74% said "my family, right or wrong"; roughly 24% said things weren't as bad as non-Southern historians claimed; and roughly 2% secretly agreed with Forrest and Davis, but would not admit to it in public because of the strange looks they received. The camp adjutant was an unabashed white supremacist. I was one of a few in the camp who were not born in the South, because it was in the Atlanta area and people after the Civil War had a habit of traveling and marrying outside of their home states. Some of us did not feel particularly comfortable at meetings, because we were interested in genealogy and military history, and not some of the other aspects of the SCV. That is what I have seen here and on other online forums that have discussed the monuments; participants do not seem to realize that their heroes are seen as villains by others.

And I believe you are projecting your prior experiences onto the membership here that disagrees with you. In your post, I don't recognize any elements of arguments that I have made.

And what is more interesting still is the number of "Yankees" speaking out here and other places in defense of monuments, museums, and against ghoulish efforts to move Confederate corpses.

[NMVolunteer]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

And I have not seen you make such posts. But this is not the only website discussing the monuments. This website does not exist in a vacuum, and the monuments did not spawn on their own accord.

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

That is what I have seen here and on other online forums that have discussed the monuments; participants do not seem to realize that their heroes are seen as villains by others.

You see, you did paint this forum with that broad brush. You can say you didn't, but there it is.
Maybe you can believe two contradictory things to be simultaneously true, but I can't.

[Eric Tipton]

Re: Do You Support the Current Movement to Remove Confederate Monuments?

As you might recall, the original intent of this poll was to establish whether or not we have a consensus within our membership and social media following to continue to oppose the removal of Confederate Monuments. Well, with hundreds of responses and over 83% supporting our position in this poll, it is obvious that we not only have consensus, but a rather overwhelming mandate for our position.

We will be announcing a specific effort in support of preserving American History very soon. Stay tuned for more information.

This poll is closed.