Drawing Rammers

[Eric Tipton]

We have watched the "Drawing Rammers" debate on Facebook with great interest. It was suggested that we weigh into the discussion, so here it is. Over the years, most, if not all "authentic campaigner" events have drawn rammers and loaded in nine times just like the originals did. If you are thinking about attending more authentic events, do you consider drawing rammers to be an authentic necessity or a dangerous practice? We believe it is the former. What do you think?

[kohnbread]

Re: Drawing Rammers

If the person loading has even basic discipline with their musket a rammer being left I the musket shouldn't be an issue, but NCOs could also watch over their guys before they fire to make sure. Even if one did get fired they don't travel far. I believe a guy video tapes him shooting with the rammer in and a blank won't send it far unless you aim high

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I used to be opposed to using them until Wauhatchie changed my view. We shot at night and still had no issue that I know of.

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Drawing Rammers

Are you referring to living history demonstrations with no one downrange, or opposed fire during shambattles? I wasn't sure from the phrasing of the OP... thanks.

[Silas]

Re: Drawing Rammers

The poll inquires about opposed firing as was done at Wauhatchie last year and the Kentucky Picket Post the year before that.

Many other higher end events have also encouraged the use of ramrods. In them, no eyes were poked out. No torsos speared. No shoulders bruised. However, many fingertips have been harmed from keyboard injuries suffered while posting about potential dangers from malicious ramrods fired by Careless Joe Reenactor.

[Eric Tipton]

Re: Drawing Rammers

However, many fingertips have been harmed from keyboard injuries suffered while posting about potential dangers from malicious ramrods fired by Careless Joe Reenactor.

Silas is correct about the events and this is one of the funniest quotes of all time.

[RSchuda]

Re: Drawing Rammers

At authentic events, I think that they should definitely be drawn and used.
However, the bigger issue is at more mainstream type events, where individuals and organizations as a whole don't only have less research, but also tend to be more lax on drill; that's more of what I see the current debate to be about, and a lot of the debating is being done between authentic reenactors and mainstream reenactors. There are many whom I would not want to be anywhere downrange from if they were attempting to load and fire with rammers. As a result, at those lower-quality events, it certainly is safer to restrict them from use; if an event only allowed certain organizations to use rammers, the others would surely create problems and complaints more so than thinking to themselves that they should try harder to improve.
This is just my opinion, based on what I've seen from other issues.

[Matthew Joe Mallory]

Re: Drawing Rammers

I must second Mr. Schuda’s comment. I recently experienced a bit of a situation at a mainstream event in Mississippi (I don’t wish to name the event). The events that occurred made me realize that the mainstream community just isn’t ready for the use of ramrods, and until they become more proficient in drill, they won’t be.

An authentic impression was raised by some people that I trust well. They are well drilled, and they have used ramrods with no issue before. I trust this unit, and I trust the people in the unit. I did not trust the other units present, which included the unit I fell in with. Saturday morning came around, with two battles planned for the day, and I was the only one drilling with the two people I brought with me to the event. When we prepared for the morning battle I watched the company I was with load, and instantly realized that they have never even opened a book of Casey’s, Hardee’s, or anything of the sort.

Saturday morning’s battle, with me acting as “Sergeant-Major” (really more of a First Sergeant, if that at all), I saw how mainstreamers reacted to drawn ramrods. They freaked out. I did try to reassure them that authentic reenactors were starting to draw ramrods now, and that it would be okay, but that did not cease their concern.

I began to realize that two things may eventually happen. First, someone will get angry and may express that anger more than verbally. Second, some untrained person is going to think that they can now draw ramrods without any training, and next thing we hear is the justification of everyone who says don’t draw ramrods. It is because of this that I have come to the belief that mainstream events are not ready for ramrods, and so they shouldn’t be used until they are. I am perfectly fine with them at authentic events, and with smaller events that I know the people attending are trained. I will continue to train my people to use them and will be happy to train anyone else that asks, but I do not yet want to see them at mainstream events.

[MadWoman]

Re: Drawing Rammers

I spent many years re-enacting the English Civil War here in the UK, before I became interested in the American Civil War. In the ECW scene tap-loading (without rammers) has been banned since the hobby started in the 1960s, and there has never been an accident despite many and large battles. Everyone has to pass a standard safety test before firing, and the NCOs keep an eye out. Not using rammers in ACW re-enactment has come over here from the States and, as far as I am concerned, is completely inexplicable. As has been shown by the ECW re-enactors, it is entirely possible to use them safely in large battles. After all, it is only play-acting, so no reason for anyone to rush or panic.

Sue Dudley

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Drawing Rammers

I must second Mr. Schuda’s comment. I recently experienced a bit of a situation at a mainstream event in Mississippi (I don’t wish to name the event). The events that occurred made me realize that the mainstream community just isn’t ready for the use of ramrods, and until they become more proficient in drill, they won’t be.

An authentic impression was raised by some people that I trust well. They are well drilled, and they have used ramrods with no issue before. I trust this unit, and I trust the people in the unit. I did not trust the other units present, which included the unit I fell in with. Saturday morning came around, with two battles planned for the day, and I was the only one drilling with the two people I brought with me to the event. When we prepared for the morning battle I watched the company I was with load, and instantly realized that they have never even opened a book of Casey’s, Hardee’s, or anything of the sort.

Saturday morning’s battle, with me acting as “Sergeant-Major” (really more of a First Sergeant, if that at all), I saw how mainstreamers reacted to drawn ramrods. They freaked out. I did try to reassure them that authentic reenactors were starting to draw ramrods now, and that it would be okay, but that did not cease their concern.

I began to realize that two things may eventually happen. First, someone will get angry and may express that anger more than verbally. Second, some untrained person is going to think that they can now draw ramrods without any training, and next thing we hear is the justification of everyone who says don’t draw ramrods. It is because of this that I have come to the belief that mainstream events are not ready for ramrods, and so they shouldn’t be used until they are. I am perfectly fine with them at authentic events, and with smaller events that I know the people attending are trained. I will continue to train my people to use them and will be happy to train anyone else that asks, but I do not yet want to see them at mainstream events.

I agree with your position over all but think the prohibition ought to be general unless and until there is some sort of recognized certification program that separates "mainstream" vs. "authentic" reenactors. Right now status as an "authentic" essentially equates to no more than self-annointment, often online... ;)

[Matthew Joe Mallory]

Re: Drawing Rammers

I agree with your position over all but think the prohibition ought to be general unless and until there is some sort of recognized certification program that separates "mainstream" vs. "authentic" reenactors. Right now status as an "authentic" essentially equates to no more than self-annointment, often online... ;)

A very valid point. I am trying to set up just that kind of certification through La Grange, but we'll see if other units get involved with it.

[DougCooper]

Re: Drawing Rammers

Great comments!!!

The mainstream community has "trained" to be dangerous... By that I mean they have omitted some important steps in drill and added steps that have never existed in the name of "safety" (and drill manual ignorance). The natural result of this is any number of different ways of doing things, ruining the safety standardization that comes from using the original manuals. Take a look at some of the standards of mainstream groups in the Pacific Northwest, where rammers are never used but direct fire is allowed at 30 feet for infantry and 75 feet for cannons. Where "battles" are fought in tiny parks and injuries are prevalent. Authenticity and leadership breeds safety, because we work at it. The older I get the more I avoid mainstream events not for lack of authenticity (mellowing), but for the potential danger.

Using rammers at our events is leadership, because it proves to the rest of the hobby that being safe means doing what was good enough for a few million original soldiers, properly drilled.

Recall that a few tompions have been fired at opposing lines not using rammers. Murphy always finds a way.

Silas that is one of the funniest quotes of all time - please attach to your signature.

[Nibs]

Re: Drawing Rammers

After all, it is only play-acting, so no reason for anyone to rush or panic.
Sue Dudley

Agreed Sue, it is a US- driven oddity. Use of ramrods is the norm in both the Sealed Knot and Napoleonic Association in UK and Napoleonic reenactment Europe-wide.

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Drawing Rammers

There are some differences between the UK and the US. Most jurisdictions here, even in places like D.C., exempt black powder replicas from firearms controls, and black powder itself doesn't require registration as an explosive. For those interested in details, please see: https://assets.publishing.service.go...l_2016_v20.pdf

If you think our regulation of contemporary weapons is loose, that for replicas is virtually nonexistent, either for the weapons themselves or the operators.

In addition, it seems that the Sealed Knot society provides a degree of training and certification. We have nothing like that here, and people saying that "authentics" are better trained are speaking of a class that identifies itself. In fact, putting "draw rammers" on an authentic checklist is a good way to encourage amateurs to use that very act as a way to self define.

I would also think your ECW and Napoleonic events are generally smaller than most of ours. I know that in the 1812 world here the scale is much reduced -- the largest event I saw was the 200th New Orleans and that compared roughly to a bad year at Cedar Creek. Fewer guns makes a difference. I've used rammers myself at some smaller events where I either knew most of the players or didn't want to offend the host. But I've seen some foolishness too.

One other difference between here and Europe is that you have national health care and tighter regulations generally. Whatever the merits of either, it does seem to make for fewer private insurance concerns and fewer threats from litigation.

My big beef isn't with authenticity, but with hubris. In fact, if we really wanted authenticity we should root for a few rammers to fire off at events -- it happened at the time, and we have the first person accounts and even photographs to show for it. And that was with boys who generally spent hundreds of hours more on the drill than even the most dedicated reenactor.

I forgot one other difference between your wars and our civil war. Yours are over... :)

[NMVolunteer]

Re: Drawing Rammers

I just cannot imagine firing a musket without using the ramrod. If they did it in 1861, it would be good enough to do in 2018. At living history events that I attend, we use ramrods, including events at state sites and NPS sites. I have seen "battle demonstrations" out here, and the number of misfires is almost comical. Pouring powder in and dropping the paper on the ground means that the powder does not completely go down the barrel, and quite a few people just fire caps only as a result. And the "smacking the butt against the ground before firing" thing looks silly.

[Scott Sheets]

Re: Drawing Rammers

I am fully in support of using ramrods at events. Someone above made the comment that the Mainstream has trained to be unsafe. That is spot on. We did a ramrod test firing last month at our spring drill. We found that without ramming paper the ramrod only fired around 5-10 feet. With paper and the weapon level it went maybe 15'. When we then rammed paper and did the standard mainstream "Safety elevation" the ramrod went well over 100' to the point we couldnt find it anymore. Ramming and firing level is not unsafe. The engagement distances, and elevating and mainstream events ARE unsafe and should be addressed.

For my part, since my guys attend both authentic and local events I am advocating that the local events at least allow us to ram the first round. I'm so tired of trying to clear weapons that wont fire from just pouring powder down the barrel. It seems like once that first round goes the weapon will at least fire from the pour only method, though I dont like it.