How do you motivate others or improve the hobby?

[plankholder]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

^{Andy and Aaron,}

^{if you are ever asked, here is your sign-wear it proudly.}

¹pro·gres·sive

Pronunciation:

\prə-ˈgre-siv\

Function:

adjective

Date:

circa 1612

1 a: of, relating to, or characterized by progress b: making use of or interested in new ideas, findings, or opportunities c: of, relating to, or constituting an educational theory marked by emphasis on the individual child, informality of classroom procedure, and encouragement of self-expression2: of, relating to, or characterized by progression3: moving forward or onward : advancing4 a: increasing in extent or severity progressive disease> b: increasing in rate as the base increases progressive tax>5often capitalized : of or relating to political Progressives6: of, relating to, or constituting a verb form that expresses action or state in progress at the time of speaking or a time spoken of7: of, relating to, or being a multifocal lens with a gradual transition between focal lengths<progressive bifocals>
— pro·gres·sive·ly adverb
— pro·gres·sive·ness noun

[rkg]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

I'm sure price can be a major concern for many people, but as it has been stated the correct materials are expensive. Add in the expence of the labor and the price goes up. It leaves many thinking wow is that overpriced. But then think of the cost of the material and the time involved to sew an article on a period sewing machine, or by hand, and profit to the vendor begins to shrink. Remeber, if anyone does this for a full time family income they must be able to turn a profit to support their family. If they can't do this they can't stay in business (unless all you approved vendors out there are huge lottery winners!), and if they can't stay in business it means you will have to make the items yourself or buy from a vendor that is using child labor, incorrect materials, and incorrect patterns. Throw in the fact that it's being made in a foreign country.
I don't mind the prices charged for the goods offered. I expect to be paid a living wage for the work I do, shouldn't a vendor have the same right? Plus how many of these suppliers of sub-standard goods have YOU seen in the feild with YOU. I KNOW there were vendors in the ranks at BGR, Shiloh, and Vicksburg with ME (As well as our upcoming ONV event at OWW). I know my fellow American approved vendors PARTICIPATE in the hobby, kind of makes me feel they also do it for the love of the hobby and are not pimping me for high profits by buying junk made in Pakistan and then passing it off as authentic.
Are the products they offer expensive; yes many are, but show me one hobby that isn't.

I would like to end with a limited solution to this problem. I intend on conducting a preservation raffle of 1 Federal kit (Museum grade blouse, JT Martin trousers, and contract shirt). It will be kind of like the one I did for Rich Mt., $5 a ticket with a limited number of tickets being sold. I'm still in the beginning phase of this and hope to post more info later under the preservation file. If any are interested in this you can shoot me a pm.

Till you see me in the field,

Robert Gobtop
Ol Sipley Mess
ONV

[GrumpyDave]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

I try to put a little money from each paycheck away so, if the need arise to purchase something I need, it doesn't wack the family budget so hard. And, saving to buy something that's really well made is always worth the wait.

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

It has been my general experience that my "need" for more gear expands with available funds. In other words, I've never been in the place where I've had everything I've needed to meet the "top" preference for every event I attend. And... "Need" is also a subjective term.

Right now, there's a double breasted officer's frock for sale on these fora for $350. Unless its damaged, I am of the opinion that the seller is under charging for the coat based on the amount of work that goes into such an item.

Does cost hold me back?
YOU BET!!!!!! I have virtually NOTHING to put together a civilian impression, yet "mustering in" and civilian militia events abound. This limits my ability to participate without borrowing significant amounts of clothing. Does that mean that civilian items are too expensive? Nope.

Part of affording things is a matter of prioritization and discipline. If you save $5/week, at the end of the year you'll have $260... enough for a top-quality jacket. What happens with most folks is they get about half the money they need or less and they lose focus and buy some "other" item that they want less, but costs less.

Another option (which is what I have done) is learn to sew. Some folks say it is too hard. It ain't. It just takes patience and discipline. Some folks say they don't have time. I have two kids and a more-than-full-time job. I generally sew between 4:30 and 6:00am. If you want something bad enough, you make it happen.

[ElizabethClark]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

Every few years, I do an update on a list of basic clothing and supplies needed to outfit a "generic" female citizen. 2007 is one of those years. Here's the synopsis of costs for a basic wardrobe (3 sets undies, 2 dresses, basic outerwear):

Buying "mainstream"--and I do mean "widely available", with hugely varying quality--it runs between $920 to nearly $1500. And most of it involves huge compromises in fabric, techniques, and shapes. The end result is a wardrobe that needs near fully-replaced to attend history-heavy events with material culture standards.

Buying "best available repros" from very skilled custom makers runs between $1068-$1700. None of these items will need replacing until they die from wear. That's just over $100 more than buying dreck--but it saves needing to replace that $900-$1500 of dreck, so in essense, doing it well the first time saves $800 to $1400... enough to outfit a whole second person.

Taking a blend of careful purchases and Do-It-Yourself, a woman will spend between $400 and $600 on the Exact Same Things. Nothing will need to be replaced unless it wears out. That means if someone is willing to do things like learn to sew their own undies (shirt and drawers for men), they'll save up to $1000 over buying dreck.

It's FAR more expensive to buy lower-accuracy stuff.

I find it interesting that top-quality makers are charging only slightly more than the dreck-makers in the citizen world. With skilled sewing being worth far more than minimum wage, few top-quality makers are actually pulling in more than a worker at McDonalds, after you figure in taxes, insurance, machine maintenance and overhead, and all the myriad expenses, small and large, that factor in to being in business.

Can price be a barrier? Sure, if you let it. I started into the hobby as a broke college student, and managed to dress myself out of my food budget (which was $40 a month, in the 1990s). It required I learn to do as much as possible for myself, and required I plan and purchase according to that plan, and sometimes excercise patience in acquiring things I wanted. It Was Possible. Now, I have to dress out five (nearly six) family members, from 44 to half-formed, and the kids need things replaced pretty much season by season. It's Still Possible. I don't have to compromise on good stuff. I do have to work at it, and make very careful purchasing choices.

So no, the upshot is: price is only a barrier if I choose to make it an excuse. Saving up takes time, but there are usually other impressions I can pursue while I get the specialty gear I may need for a particular event. The events I choose to attend generally have a lead time of up to a year and a half--time to arrange things, find used resources, learn skills, save up...

[1stMaine]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

Johnny, et al,

I wouldn't say that money keeps me from being more authentic. It does, however, keep me from attending more events. Even with putting some money aside, learning to make some things, and careful planning and purchasing, it still doesn't work out.

Unexpected expenses can take a considerable bite out of the available funds. For example, the washer and dryer both died within a single week. Having three children, I cannot afford to NOT have a washer and dryer, so that was a big hit.

Couple that with living in Maine. I also don't drive due to recent eye surgeries. That means that if I cannot share a ride with someone, I have to fly, take the train or the bus. Many times, that's an adventure in itself in frustration. To travel to the Septemeber Storm event, I have to take one bus company to Boston, then another to Hagerstown Md. Fortunately, I scored a ride from there. It is still, however, 18 hours each way. For the Fredericksburg event in October, that actually easier. I take the bus to Boston, then the train to Fredericksburg where I can get a lift out to the event site.

Still, and all, it's rare that travel expenses run less than $150.00, so there again, I have to budget funds. Like some others, I will not try and "get by". If I don't have the gear, I'll pass on the event. Folks demand high standards, and I know how I would feel if I worked to reach them and someone else didn't.

I do NOT mind paying for the items I want, even when they might be higher than what some would thing needs be. There is an awful lot of cost that fols do not realise is associated with producing a garment that must be somehow recouped. The time spent researching the original artifact, the cost(s) to travel, lodging, food, film and developing, making the patterns, etc. Every hour spent researchin and/or travelling to do the research, every hour meant making patterns, finding materials, working out the assembly order, etc, is time that cannot be spent making something else, and the only way that any income will be derived is through selling finished goods.

Let's say the maker spent $1000.00 on costs researching and developing the garment (a not at all unreasonable amount). He now has to calculate just how many of that item will, in all honesty, sell. If he realistically expects to sell only 50 of them, then he's going to have to tack on an extra $20.00 each just for the pre-manufacturing costs. That doesn't include having to purchase all of the cloth and notions up front. Say 2.5 yards of fabric for each item, at 50 items each, that 125 yards of material. Plus an equal amount of material for the lining, interfacing, etc. Figure 6 buttons @ $1 each. Let's say it's $35.00/yard combined for material and lining, etc. There's $4375.00 plus $300 for buttons plus the $1000 for the research, etc. He's now $5675.00 so there is $115.50 in up front costs before the jacket is even made. Now he has to pay himself. It goes on and on.

No, I don't think that costs are at all out of line, it's just that my income hasn't risen to support my desires at present :) Like I said, I sometimes have to make a choice as to the events I attend, simply because of the travel expenses.

Respects,

[GrumpyDave]

Economics, Marketing and Sales 101

Now, I know this “discussion” will eventually devolve into an Us v, Them argument. And, I know this topic has been hashed, hashed and rehashed a bazillion times with out resolution.(There is no resolution) And, I know the folks who really need to read and think about this are not readers of on line forums(There are 1000’s of those folks). So, after much thought here goes(Well, 4 hours sleep and a cup of coffee or two).

Is there anyone out there who doesn’t want their events to be “better?” I find the answer to that often asked question simple. The answer is an emphatic “NO!” There are 1000’s of folks out there who don’t care if the status quo changes; ever. And, that is quite clear. They attend the same events, year after year and are quite happy with the way things exist. These people outnumber the folks who want a “better event” by far and away. Ergo, the folks who organize the same events that happen year after year of 5 year anniversary after anniversary don’t give a hoot in he11 about changing their events. And, if those same people have a product that sells, why tamper with a money maker?


Those folks who want “better” events have the opportunity to attend them. Those events have become more and more available over the last few years and, being willing to make small personal and financial concessions to get closer to actual history, folks go. These events are scheduled, generally, when ever the organizer feels like, without concern for the events listed in the previous paragraph. Why you ask? Because in many cases, there are clearly two different consumer bases to be drawn from and, never the two shall meet. This group of consumers being decidedly smaller than the group who “doesn’t care to change,” also, doesn’t care, for the most part about buying the other product or, the differences in the events created by their smaller numbers. These consumers are willing to sacrifice things they consider unnecessary, in order to purchase what they also consider a better product.


Is this division created by those who constantly complain about the products out there for sale on internet boards? No. Then, where does the division begin? That’s easy; the division begins with the producers of the product. So, when does a product get itself changed or removed from the market? That’s easy, when folks stop buying the product or demand a change in the product by threatening not to purchase it. Even with the declining numbers in those purchasing the offered products, the large percentage of consumers still prefer one product, continue to purchase that product, and, you don’t have to be hit on the head to see that quite clearly. The consumer group likes the product, doesn’t want it to be changed and the proof is; as consumers they keep buying.


So, here’s how I see it. If I don’t like the product, I don’t buy it. That mantra is the same for millions of folks and products across the country and around the world. And, those folks won’t buy a product they don’t want, need or like on purpose, ever. Been there, done that, and the product doesn’t work for me, it doesn’t fill my needs. And, the times I have purchased a product I don’t especially like, I do so with the knowledge beforehand. And, ergo, I know what to expect from the product. So, why should I spend money on a product I don’t need when, I can get one that I feel I do need? So, why should the way I purchase a product be different just because this is the “Recreation of the Civil War,” in some, way, shape or, form? For me, there is no difference. And, that’s exactly the way it works for 1000’s of folks, most of who, by far and away, could care less about what’s posted on an Internet board.

So, if you want “Campaigners” or, “Authentics” or “insert your favorite term” to attend “Mainstream” or “Mega” or “National” or “insert your favorite term here” events, you’ll have to find consumers who like the product and sell them into taking on that role.

So, OK now, that’s enough Marketing, Economics and Sales 101.

Mods, I hope this doesn’t create another headache for you. God knows you have enough.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Economics, Marketing and Sales 101

Hallo!

"So, if you want “Campaigners” or, “Authentics” or “insert your favorite term” to attend “Mainstream” or “Mega” or “National” or “insert your favorite term here” events, you’ll have to find consumers who like the product and sell them into taking on that role."

Agreed, but I am not sure what point you are making?

People do what works for them.
When it comes to restaurants, if I want Chinese food, I would generally not go to an Italian restaurant.
IMHO, "Mainstream" anything is called that because it is the mainstream- what the vast majority of those in that activity, hobby, group do, and do it in a common mass way.
Which takes us to "why" say, a so-called H/A lad would want to attend say a so-called F/M event when the "cultures" are so different as to uniform/gear, impressions/persona, and "historic soldierly" activities 24/7 (hate that term...)?

And that is what tends to divide us along a number of lines, some of which seem to be dependent upon our personal length of time in the Civil War Community as we evolve or pass thorugh different 'Development Stages" such as:

1. F/M'ers do not want to "be" F/M'ers and really want to "be" H/A'ers. So, we attend F/M events to do "missionary work" and convert the heathens by showing them the Light and Error of Their Ways, as we guide tham to the Promised H/A Land.

or

2. F/M'ers do not want to "be" F/M'ers and want to "be" H/A'ers, and are unhappy and wandering around blind and dumb. So we attend F/M events to "lead by example" leading the errants by showing them the Light and Error of Their Ways, as we guide tham to the Promised H/A Land.

or

3. A few F/M'ers do not want to "be" F/M'ers and want to "be" H/A'ers, but lack the knowledge, resosurces, leadership, opportunities, pathways to get there. So we attend F/M events to recruit and lead out those willing emigrants to where they want to be in the Promised H/A Land.

or

4. We attend F/M events to visit old friends and socialize.

or

5. We attend F/M events because we are masochists for the self-infliced punishment of stares, glares, whispered/muted/obvious comments or gestures about "What are THEY doing here?" or "Button Pissers," "Authenticity Nazi's," "Period Correctness Police," etc, etc.

IMHO, the more "experience over time," and the more open wounds, and scars one has from evolving from No. 1 thorugh No. 5, the more they influence one views and behaviors.

Are Nos. 1-5 the products we are selling to to get so-called H/A'ers to attend so-called F/M'er events? ;) :)

Others' mileage, as well as experience/wounds/scars, will vary...

Curt

[Charles Heath]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

Johnny,

First, you might want to follow the rules about using names. While 99.9% of us know Jno. is shorthand for John, it still violates the signature rule. Sigh.

My first thought after reading your post was "is there a point to this post?" That pretty much sums up my second and third thoughts, too.

Last year, I watched over $120,000 worth of equipment ease out of The Bunker's front yard to an NPS living history just down the road, and thought about how far we had come from the days of SOYAs to the kind of quality events we have today, and how that dollar figure was insignificant compared to the investment the individual participants would bring to the event.

A couple of hundred million years ago, in the early days of the hobby, people would just buy crap willy nilly based on the "that's so kewl" factor. For the past ten years at least, active participants (these are people who actually attend events) typically pick up the checklist from the event guidelines, and work down the prioritized selection. After feeling satisfied about the #1 and #2 choices, they base their purchases on the elimination of those #3, #4, and worse scores. That's how people buy things. If there is anyone in the hobby who doesn't understand this, please stick up your hand now.

Buehler?

Buehler?

Anyone?

Good.

Now, to get into some specifics:

1) NO excuse for knowingly buying "farby" stuff.

Just about everything we buy, make, or use in the field is farb to some extent. That's nothing new, and the challenge to find the least farb amongst the choices is also nothing new. The half distance equation has not changed one iota.

2) "Good" purchases are worth putting out extra money for in the long run- no use in buying junk for the short-term or might fall apart in the long haul.

Yes, the Scot essay on False Economy applies here. Everyone knows that one by heart.

3) Anyone can see that good purchases with quality construction from an approved vendor are better than anything Pakistanis can mass produce...

Yes, I think otherwise, and also know otherwise. Two Pakistani single source items come to mind, and they show up frequently in Authenticist, Campaigner, Progressive, and Hardcore environments. Terry Sorchy recently told me at the Vicksburg NPS LH one of those items is no longer being made, and I really must follow up on that. Come to think of it, a heck of a lot of small brass items are Pakistani and/or Indian make, even on the 2/3 the hobby that prides itself in eschewing such.

4) We owe it to ourselves, our fellow reenactors, and the public that happen....!

That's getting pretty close to the farb mantra of "educating the public," which has creating a booming business for the enclosed tandem axle utility trailer market in recent years.

1) In this, have you ever found yourself saying no to a product because you thought it was overpriced, but you knew it was what your particular impression needed?

To cite one example, an impression primarily based on a $2,500 longarm with dubious ammunition sources was enough to send up the red flag. That event was cancelled. Whew. Most of the time, at least on this end of the hobby, gear is often swapped about or borrowed, and the AC Forum classified ads have been a boon to reproduction gear collectors in all six categories.

2) Do you feel some prices have gotten a -little too- expensive for authentic gear?

I remember the intense shame of reading about a certain vendor who claimed to have the most authentic reproduction hardware available on his knapsacks, and I immediately went back to the reenacting room, opened the closet, picked up my old knapsack, held it up to the light, and exclaimed, "Curse you! Curse you, Heywood, for using original hardware! You made farbs of all of us!" About that time a little voice from within the knapsack said, "Get your stinkin' paws off me, you d-mned dirty ape." Hmmmm. Now, there's a mental picture for Curt.

3) Do you feel high prices have or are currently discouraging mainstreamers from being more authentic?

For the past five or six years, thanks to the fire sale here on the AC Forum, folks have been able to buy scads of gear for bargain prices. The thrifty shopper has been able to buy top end gear for less than sutler row prices. Some units have developed hunter-killer wolfpacks....er "acquisition committees" to jump on certain used items as they become available. Many of these items are in new or like new condition, since the original owner bought, stored, fondled, but never seemed to actually attend more than a couple of events, if any. This latter enigma was an epidemic in the mid-Atlantic area.

4) Is is possible to get "fleeced" by buying "overpriced" (yep, it's subjective) authentic gear from a reputable dealer...

Yes. Every time I fill up the fuel tank on the trucks, tractors, or car. I can't wait to buy the other half of the winter hay supply, speaking of getting gouged.

5) If this condition exists on a broad scale, what is the remedy for bringing down costs, yet not sacrificing true quality for the authentic end of the hobby as a whole? !

Bring down costs? In late 1994 I paid $325 for a coat and trousers from a top end vendor. I wore out the pants and sold them for what I paid for them. (You read that right.) The jacket still has a number of years left, and the cut and construction still knocks the socks off most jeanscloth products in the field today. I can probably still get $275 for it, or $250 on a bad day. Other than that, the Euro is kicking our arse in terms of weapons prices, but the $299 Enfield is still out there on the used market.

This is a great time to be in the hobby.

[Drygoods]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

Mr. Lloyd,

In our house, we are split between military and civilian goods, however, it is safe to say that we have considerably more civilian articles of clothing and personal items &c. No, I would not say that things are overpriced when it comes to what is available to civilians. If you are willing to do a good impression, than you should be willing to pay for it, quality does have it's price.

Do you feel high prices have or are currently discouraging mainstreamers from being more authentic? Absolutely not. What discourages mainstreamers from being authentic is their own ignorance. You can enter any tent the 'Dope Deluxe Swindle Sutlery' and find all sorts of trashy articles of clothing, totally inaccurate, and at high inflated prices and find yourself fleeced out of hundreds of dollars in minutes. Well, if some participant is that foolish and hasn't bothered to do research with clothing, construction, and period correct material culture.....well, tough cheese on them. I don't say that people deserve what they get, they shouldn't, but why buy things when you don't know what you're going to need? I see this often enough, way too often, where sutlers sell trash and innocent people who haven't learned any better buy junk. It's our own fault, if you're club or site allows people who sell junk into the event, then your own people are going to look terrible. Anything done well takes practice, and it's that practice and time spent doing reading and research that proves quality. So 'discouraging mainstreamers from being authentic' is their own choice, I mean, they could have learned a bit more and started authentic instead of buying rubbish and maintaining a mainstream lifestyle.:sarcastic

Honestly, I think that forums would do a better service if they dropped the approved vendor links and started with an Avoid Vendor page.:angry_smi

[MO-Pard]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

3) Do you feel high prices have or are currently discouraging mainstreamers from being more authentic? (I feel it has done so to a certain point... maybe you do too.)

Similar to what Charles and Judith were both getting close to; is, No. What discourages mainstreamers and farb units, are themselves and their mindset. They use 'price' as a crutch or excuse, and thereby in their own minds (and those they think they have fooled/swayed) have justified what they know is blatantly wrong.

These same people, who like to masquarade or proclaim themselves 'hardcore' or campaigner, in front of their peers or to rub elbows with the genuine campaingers/hardcores. These are the same people who will have wall tents/A-frames at an event they are "campaigning" at and the camp will be filled with adirondack chairs, tables, blue speckleware coffee pots, large steal grill grates, etc. Folks going to events with this stuff it doesn't really matter who made your jacket or cartridge box, or what they cost, because you've already blown the impression.

They don't truly want to be a hardcore or campaigner other than name and a hight "post count" (thinking the more posts I have the more respected or authentic I am.) If they did (unless they are an officer or it is a garrison event), they would gear up at the car and march whatever distance, 2 yards or 2 miles, in one trip. Heck, it is not uncommon in our unit to be awaken at 1:00 a.m., and march to a new bivouac. I'm digressing here somewhat, but point being, it isn't a price preventing them.

The first and biggest factor, IMHO, to be authentic/campaigner, comes from a decision in the head and heart, that "I am going to do it right." C/P/H'ers, make sure ahead of time through planning and research, that everything they wear, say or live around for that weekend is right. Money, is of secondary concern and importance. Discipline in attitude, kit and camp are more important, and as others have echoed part of planning is borrowing. If one is really a hardcore/campaigner, and they can't put the impression together, skip it and continue working for the next one.

Lastly, are the prices too high? In most cases, no. I make a lot of my own clothing for myself, others, a museum and even a movie company. By the time you secure the proper materials, take measurements, construct, adjust and take into account the amount of hand-work for a certain garment, you're probably working for less than minimum wage. Just ask guys like Scott, Fred Baker, Cody, Don Smith, etc. I recommend all the new guys to our mess actually handsew a shirt........ no one complains after they learn the time and effort it requires.

My $.02

Best Regards

[ley74]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

The most expensive part of this hobby was finding out two years in that everything I had purchased, up to that point, was crap. Several of my friends did the same thing. As has been stated many times, buy once.

I might also bring in the thread on vendors, rumbling around here for several weeks. Know who you are buying from. The AC is a great launching point. Waiting for a high-quality product is also usually required. Finally, as Kevin O'Beirne helped teach us, the material part is only a fraction of what you need to bring.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

Hallo!

Hey.. I thought I wrote the False Economy Mantra in a newsletter in the Fall of 1986?
;-) :-)

Not that the one refers or relates to the other, but is there a corelation possibly going on here between the opinions expressed on price and authenticity and the low/lower number of posts? Possibly hinting at a different perspective or reality caused by a more recent shift or migration to the righthand side of the Alphabet Letters? ;) :) :)
Just a-funnin'....

Seriously...

Sometimes, "price" becomes the Sour Grapes tale we tell ourselves, and then others to justify things, or to save face, or to avoid peer pressure. And then start actually believing it whether true or not.
(Not that folks have unlimited budgets, or unlimited disposable income, or free or unincumbered amounts of income they can throw at their hobbies and interests without limit...)

Between the Principle of False Economy and the AC Forum buy-sell folder, where accepted so-called "H/A" end items can often be had for the near, or same price, or even lower price, than the same so-called new F/M items- I am having trouble seeing why "price" would be/could be/should a deterrant to "authenticity."

Or does "Migration" and "Evolution to the Righthand Side" cause Sticker Shock? Meaning:
Husband of SO: Honey, I just paid $1,000 for this kit last year and this year I "are a Authentic" and have to buy ANOTHER $1,000 in new kit!"
Wife or SO: "WHAT?!!!"

Or does prior and current experience only with say the Sutlers' Row Run of the Mill Brand X Pakistani $15 blouse being sold for $125 become the "memory' when a premier maker/vendor's blouse is seen costing say $250?

This is all assuming "authentic" or "authenticity" is being defined as SOLELY as a matter of clothes and gear, which takes both the merry-go-round and the brass ring around again...

And in the end, it does not matter as there is no reality, only perception.
Meaning, if lads perceive cost/price to be a barrier t "authenticity" , it is a barrier not an excuse.

Others' mileage, and selling and buying on the Ac Forum, may vary...

Curt

Yes, price keeps me, personally, from being more authentic; because everything is not free.
I would like to buy an authentic Civil War town and a million square acres of surrounding 1860ish land to play in, but...
Talk about Sticker Shock, and price barriers to authenticity. Sheesh...

[Pennvolunteer]

Re: Does being a modern Joe make you better at your impression?

I'm coming to this late, but I find it very interesting. With 24 years of active duty, I have to say I think there are lots of common soldier issues like field craft, truly understanding the chain of command, understanding standards, etc, that we all take for granted if you have been a soldier. I often find myself somewhat frustrated with non-veterans who re-enact, especially if they are sloppy, don't take care of weapons and equipment, don't get the real role of leaders, and have no field skills. Many are very self-conscious and ask for help, but others are oblivious.
On the other hand, I have to be very deliberate in not slipping into modern soldiering, as it is natural but different from living history of 1861-65. Something as simple as not cupping my hands and swinging "9 to the front and 6 to the rear" as I march.
There are great comments on here, and the bottom line is maintaining an authentic impression. I think being a soldier helps me relate to the folks we honor with our hobby, (and certainly allows me to know how to stay a little more comfortable in the field). On the other hand, it is a different era, and sometimes I go with instinct and training, which detracts from my impression. It is also hard not to take charge when you see something wrong, and remember your place in the living history scenario. On the lighter side, since I portray an infantry private or artillery cannoneer, I think my mess-mates get a kick out of calling my by my real rank to confuse visitors. I often joke it off as "another army on another continent"!
Anyway, great discussion. I've really enjoyed reading the threads.

[aetius123]

Re: Does price hurt your authenticity?

I believe most of the main stream reenactors balk at the purchase of authentic reproductions because of a lack of education. A lot of the reenacting groups in my area encourage people to buy their initial gear from budget sutlers. Unfortunately, most of the sutler row uniforms and gear don't last and the recruit eventually shells out more money to replace these substandard items. As mentioned in earlier posts several groups also invest large amounts of money in tents and camp furniture, and then complain about the high cost of authentic uniforms.

I started reenacting in 2002. My initial gear would not be considered authentic. Through my research and recently with the help of this site I've ugraded a lot of my gear. I've purchased a couple items from the approved venders, but I'm constantly searching for a used bargains and have had occasional luck. The cost of some items is prohibitive. A well made frock coat would be a good example. Luckily I don't require this for my group. I would also like to purchase several civilian items, but once again my current budget prevents me from doing this.

John Winkler
Co K 6th TX