Two Girls

[Mississippian]

Everyone,

Here is a photo of my girlfriends GGG Grandmother, Laura Boyd, as a young girl in rural East Mississippi ca. 1858. On the right is her younger sister Anna. The Boyd's lived in Neshoba county Mississippi, the family owned about $1,000 in real estate and $1,000 in personal estate according to the 1860 census.

Will MacDonald

[Old Cremona]

Re: Two Girls

Awesome. You're lucky to have such an image.

[Emmanuel Dabney]

Re: Two Girls

I hate to be the bearer of some unfortunate news but...

The image appears to be post-war to me.

Why?

-I admit I'm not an expert in "young girls'" clothing but the sleeves and high necklines appear post-war to me.
-The fact that the image appears to be a tintype also calls into question its era. See http://www.floridamemory.com/photogr...es/tintype.cfm for more on the period of popularity for tintypes.

[Hank Trent]

Re: Two Girls

-I admit I'm not an expert in "young girl's" clothing but the sleeves and high necklines appear post-war to me.

I don't know much about young girls' clothing either, but I agree. Just doesn't feel right. Something about the hair. Liz Clark, where are you? :)

Hank Trent
hanktrent@gmail.com

[crabby]

Re: Two Girls

Even before reading Emmanuel & Hank's post, my first thought upon viewing the photo was "1870's".

[MartaV]

Re: Two Girls

This appears to be a glass plate; and if the image is a glass plate (dag or ambro) then it could very well date to the war years or earlier. By the mid 60's they were not using that media much if at all. The armscyes are off shoulder, the hairstyle is correct. I think 1858 is a reasonable date for this image. And girl's dresses could have a frill at the neck rather than a collar. Adult rules in clothing did not necessarily apply to children's things in this era.

[VMurphy]

Re: Two Girls

My first reaction was the same, a bit post war. Essentially because of the neckline/shoulder line of the bodices. But it's very difficult to see clearly. Marta...do you have a copy? or the original. Do you know for certain that it's a glass plate or tintype? Their hair is very tied up and parted in the center which is very much 1850s-60s or a bit later for children. I have an original bright pink silk taffeta bodice for a young girl that is made with a high neck, ruffle at the neck, long tight sleeves with large covered buttons down the back. The shoulders are dropped, and the waist is a dropped V...very much like the bodices shown here. I agree it could very well be 1858. Frankly I don't believe that the photo can be seen clearly enough to judge any differently.
Regards
Vivian Murphy

http://www.themantuamaker.net

[Mississippian]

Re: Two Girls

Hmmmmm....my girlfriend is trying to make a post giving some more background to the photo, since it's her first post, it's been blockaded by the mods......

Will MacDonald

(Note from Liz Clark: Mods don't blockade posts. New users have their first few posts go through the moderation queue for approval before they're released to the general boards. Since there are only three of us citizen mods, and we all have real lives and jobs and family responsibilities, sometimes it takes a few days to work through the queue. :) )

[NeshobaSweetheart]

Re: Two Girls

I believe the image to be a Daguerrotype, giving descriptions I've read, but I am no expert in these things. I can however vouch that the girl on the left is indeed my great-great-great grandmother. I remember the day my mother found the photo, it was at my great-great aunt Sammie's house. We had taken my great-grandmother, Maude Aramatha, to visit her and her other sister, Lura. They all said it was their grandmother, Laura Aramatha, and chastised my mother for not naming me Aramatha since I so greatly resembled her, and the name is of particular familial pride. So unless the date of my GGGgrandmother's birth is wrong, 1858 should be about the timing of the photo.

[ElizabethClark]

Re: Two Girls

NeshobaSweetheart, please don't forget to sign your name to your posts! If you want help getting an automatic signature files set up on your profile, let me know.

[ElizabethClark]

Re: Two Girls

The problem with family lore is that it's not always reliable, even when it seems it ought to be, because everyone is so *sure* of it.

Some things that stand out to me, and I'm wishing I could get a clearer look at the image:

1: The dresses lay with some fairly modest fullness, which would either push them back into the 1840s, or forward into the late 1860s, 1870s.
2: The hairstyles have some tight control going on in the upper temple area, which would be fairly atypical for the 1850s, but *really* normal for the 1870s.
3: The frill could be seen at any point in the 1840s, 1850s, 1860s, or 1870s, so that's indeterminate.
4: The shoulder drop on the armscye is small, but present. Again, that could be post-war, but could also be slightly atypical, and late 50s/early 60s. The sleeve itself is one that is bog-common in the 1870s.

I do see some tucking lines in the skirts, which is just an interesting feature, and does not aid in dating.

Unfortunately, I'd really need to see the image in a clearer scan and finer resolution to read some of the details.

What is the medium? Is the image on a metal plate, glass plate, or paper?

[Mississippian]

Re: Two Girls

If it helps, here is a known picture of Laura Boyd as a grown woman. I think they they are the same person.

Lauren forgot to mention that in that same trunk was found a wartime image of Laura Boyd's soon to be husband, Pvt. James Deck Combs, of Company D, 11th Mississippi Infantry. Pvt. Combs is wearing one of the many variants of early war Mississippi frock coats.

Will MacDonald

[Hank Trent]

Re: Two Girls

I believe the image to be a Daguerrotype, giving descriptions I've read, but I am no expert in these things.

I'm really curious if it's a dag or a tintype. What features does it have that make you think it's a dag? Does a magnet stick to it (tintype)? Does it have a coppery color to it and you have to hold it just right to get the image to show up (dag), or is it mostly shades of gray and black, and pretty much the same from every angle (tintype)? Also, it appears to be out of its case, much more common for a tintype. Are those the full dimensions? Dags were rarely that tall for their width.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@gmail.com

[NeshobaSweetheart]

Re: Two Girls

. It's much shinier than some of the other tin types I have, and the metal is a different color. I'll try to dig it out this afternoon and test the magnet theory.

Lauren M.

[ElizabethClark]

Re: Two Girls

Mod Bonnet On: Last name, too, not just initials. :) Mod Bonnet Off.

Dageurreotypes are really fragile when it comes to oxidation--the images can actually rub off if handled--and the copper plates won't catch a magnet (test on the back side). Ferrotypes are on a metal sheet that will catch a magnet, and the images are often reversed (left is right, right is left).

Is the image this dark and obscured in person, or is it lighter/brighter? I'd love to get a closer look at the clothing, but the current photo of it is not allowing as clear a view as in-person. The clothing may be fairly atypical for the family lore date.