Porch Boards??

[Stonewall_Greyfox]

Wife and I are in the process of restoring our 1850s farmhouse. Porch elements are on the list to start this winter...and we're looking for documented examples (either period published references, or existant examples) of flooring widths for porches.

I'm aware that porch floors were commonly made from materials available, but also know that of the materials commonly seen, mahoganey is not considered uncommon. Since the porch posts are mahoganey - we're considering doing the floor with this material. Just in need of some direction with regards to flooring width.


Thoughts?

Paul B.

[rbruno]

Re: Porch Boards??

Paul,
I guess the first thing I would see is what is currently on the porch. But, probably what is there is not what was orginal, otherwise you would have your answer. I have taken down several old house to reclaim the lumber for furniture and think this is a tricky answer because as you said, many times they used what was available. I can't say that I have come across outside porch flooring in mahogany yet. I have seen the post, handrails, and spindles because it is rot resistant and nice to finish. I have pulled apart an early 1800's log home made of chestnutt logs that had very wide chestnutt boards for a porch. A family member has a 1860s farm house that is brick with a mix of hardwoods and pine as a support structure and his porch has oak floor boards that are about 6 inches wide. Another home I took apart was almost all pine and had pine boards on the porch and all the floors. I think I have seen more pine, but it has been the heart pine in narrow widths that I see more of. I think it would depend as much on what was available, so what is your house constructed of? Pine, oak, chestnutt? What is around your house as far as woods? Are there any old woods left around to see what types of trees are around? In the 1850s, chestnutt was still very popular and I have read that there were more chestnutt trees in the forest then Oak when the settlers first landed. I can't imagine the expense of buying chestnutt for a porch today.
Just food for thought.

[Stonewall_Greyfox]

Re: Porch Boards??

Rob,

Naturally, the original porch boards are long gone...

House constructed originally in 1850s...somewhere in my pile of notes - I came across a few references to Mahoganey Flooring for Porches (due to it's natural rot resistance), surprisingly still painted. I know...hard to believe but aparantly common enough...heck Brazilian Ippe (South American Mahoganey) was produced as a flooring up until a few years ago - now this stuff has gotten scarce. House construction - Almost Entirely Oak...siding may very well be Cypruss (again used due to it's natural resistance to moisture)...Original Purlins are approx. 3 ft x 6 ft Red Cedar.

Again, looking for documented examples of porch board widths...

Paul B.

[jake.koch]

Re: Porch Boards??

Supposedly the porch on a home in Charlestown, Virginia(now West Virginia) was built from the gallows used to hang John Brown. That may be similiar to the hundreds of pikes made and sold by blacksmiths after the fact and the miles of rope used to hang him that was in existence at one time; or a handy use for the gallows wood - I wonder if this would have been common to do? It would be kind of morbid to think about while you are sitting on it sipping lemonade. I know thats not what you are looking for but your post made me remember that.

[Doughboy]

Re: Porch Boards??

I have seen tons of pine from period homes and board widths were much wider than is currently available. Also the pine from those days is way different from modern pine. Most was very old growth and virtually indestructible to weather and insect damage. Modern pine wood would not have the hardness, width or longevity of period pine wood.

[Stonewall_Greyfox]

Re: Porch Boards??

Chris,

Thanks...I'm aware that HEART PINE was commonly used on interior flooring...and sometimes on porch flooring (of varying widths).

As requested - we're looking for DOCUMENTED Examples of dimensions...and wood types...

Paul B.

[VA-Patriot'61]

Re: Porch Boards??

Paul, give my Dad a call. He may be able to steer you in the right direction or put you in touch with someone (maybe one of the carpenter guys at CW) that can help you out. Things I would look for if you haven't already is what saw mills were owned nearby? what were they cutting primarily if family or county records show anything? maybe something in the local paper advertised their services? I'm sure there are alot of awesome sources out there but like everything else it just takes time to dig into them to find what we need. Seriously though call my Old Man and he'll be of some help.

[J. Donaldson]

Re: Porch Boards??

Have you contacted any house museums in your area to see if they have similar documentation on their structures? A well-run institution should have documentation on just about every aspect of their buildings down to nail patterns (did this for a one room school museum with the fastener patterns from where the desks were placed.) Perhaps, if you could talk to enough of them, you could get a consensus for your area.

[P. M. Cunningham, Tinner]

Re: Porch Boards??

Been avoiding this for the last week. First and most important are images. There is no standard for 19th C. board widths which is why construction can vary regionally. Good chance what you are looking for already exists in ghost images and nail patterns on the existing structure.

Pat Cunningham

[Doughboy]

Re: Porch Boards??

I suppose it depends on what you mean by documented. I have worked on a number of historic homes and have personally found sizes to be quite random. There were no lumber standards at the time and the widths were dependent only on the quality of the tree used and the skill of the sawyer. An older tree could yield clean boards as wide as 2' and as long as 20'. Much of the wider stock was used for furniture and the boards for cladding and flooring was generally random lengths and widths.

[Stonewall_Greyfox]

Re: Porch Boards??

Been avoiding this for the last week.

And why is that?

First and most important are images. There is no standard for 19th C. board widths which is why construction can vary regionally.

I'm quite aware of that possibility...not only board widths, but also materials used in construction. I'm of the opinion (note this is an opinion, not substantiated by hard-fast documentation), that these elements can be more common by region, or stateliness of the structure. What's found in Central VA - may/may not be what's indicative of frontier settlement stuff, though post-industrial revolution - there fairly good cases for standard widths/dimensions.

Good chance what you are looking for already exists in ghost images and nail patterns on the existing structure.

Nope...good chance it doesn't, we've been at this particular project for 2 yrs. now...I'm NOT new to the investigatory review of underlaying structural components (this is how we determined the original roof had been wood shingle/shake, and not tin as what was on the house when we purchased it). The original porch/substructure is l-o-o-o-n-g gone. All that remains from the original porch are the porch columns. No evidence as to what the predescesor may have consisted of...

Have you contacted any house museums in your area to see if they have similar documentation on their structures? A well-run institution should have documentation on just about every aspect of their buildings down to nail patterns (did this for a one room school museum with the fastener patterns from where the desks were placed.) Perhaps, if you could talk to enough of them, you could get a consensus for your area.

I think what you'll find is that the majority of institutions across the county are SEVERELY lacking in documentation...some really knowledgable folks out there...BUT, LOTs of options, and many museums have had a quick transformation from private to public hands - often with the investigatory period lasting generations (e.g. they're still learning things from the surviving structures in C.W.)...and yes, been through old-museums throughout the Commonwealth, some are more knowledgeable than others.

Paul B.

[SoMD Swamprat]

Re: Porch Boards??

What about your county's preservation architect? They generally do a much more thorough job of documenting such things than most museums. Might not be a bad idea to contact Roy Underhill, as well. Also, there used to be an architectural salvage dealer in the Falmouth/Stafford area who dealt in a lot of Victorian & Antebellum millwork, etc. If he's still around you may be able to get some useful info from him.

Best of luck,

Jim Ball

[Doughboy]

Re: Porch Boards??

http://www.gcidc.com/woodlawnhouse.html

This is a link to a film a friend of mine did on a complete R&R of an 18th century house in the Shenandoah Valley.

[Stonewall_Greyfox]

Re: Porch Boards??

Gentlemen,

I've been in touch with the local Historical Society, the Virginia Department of Historic Resources...and with the the local architectural historian. These leads to date, have NOT yielded a wealth of information. As posted earlier in the discussion, I'm not new to research. I'm also familiar with the WPA HABS project - though unfortunately, those reports (and subsequent reports filed through the VDHS), don't give much detail for the 'common' old house. Most of these reports that were done on SIGNIFICANT homesites (e.g. Patrick Henry's Scotchtown) are pages and pages of detailed dimensioned drawings, photographs...etc. But for houses that were'nt of this calibre, the reports are typically limited to 2-3 pages of the standard overhead with spartan details...

Paul B.