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Found this as I was organizing some of the threads I'd saved from the pre-crash forum. Hope nobody minds me posting it (I make have to post the pictures seperately:
John Taylor
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The Authentic Campaigner Forums
- General Discussion: Authentic Citizenry and Civilians
-- Period enamel-ware pots
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 19th, 2003 11:06 PM:
Period enamel-ware pots
Does anyone have any inforamtion on enamel-ware during the 1850s and 60s. I know that it was first used in the 1790s, but remained largely unused until late in the 19th century. More impportantly does anyone know where I could get a large enamel pot (at least 5 qts).
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Hank Trent on July 20th, 2003 04:43 AM:
Actually, I've found quite a bit of evidence of enamelware being used in the mid 19th century in period cookbooks--but it's almost always mentioned as being used as a preserving kettle for jellies and such.
There's some enamelware at the Arabia museum, and it's typical of the period stuff--a white coating, on the inside of the container only, and on what appears to be cast iron rather than on sheet metal.
Where can you get it today? I have no idea. Somewhere it exists, though, because on one of the earlier Survivor shows, there was a nice close-up shot of them cooking in what appeared to be a period-style cast iron pot with a white enamel lining. I'm figuring that third-world countries might still be making them, but I have no clue how to find one.
Edited to add: It's probably not in usable condition, but here's an example of the white-on-the-inside-of-cast-iron kind of enamelware on eBay right now: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...&category=4708 . Don't know if that piece is truly period. It would help to see the bottom to see if there's a gate mark, and somebody more knowledgeable could probably date it by the shape of the bale holders. But it gives you an idea.
Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net
__________________
.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by KLCoombs on July 20th, 2003 04:23 PM:
Arabia enamelware
woo hoo -- finally going to the Arabia -- flew to Kansas City yesterday and leaving to drive to museum in a few minutes. Am bringing digital camera of course. If I can get a good shot of the enamelware, I'll post it here.
__________________
Kathryn Coombs
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 20th, 2003 05:04 PM:
Thanks for the info. I completely forgot about the Arabia. I used to live right down the road from the museum, and have been there many times. I didn't recall any enamel-ware, but your post made me go digging through old pistures and sure enough I have a few. Thanks for the help.
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by KLCoombs on July 21st, 2003 07:59 AM:
Enamelware on the Arabia
As promised....
[IMG]bigenamelpot.jpeg[/IMG]
large cast iron enamel pot from the Steamship Arabia cargo. As Hank noted, it is enameled on the inside only. The general look is similar to modern-day Le Creuset, only without the colored enamel on the outside.
[IMG]smallenamelpot.jpeg[/IMG]
Enamelware saucepan from the Arabia. Also enameled only on the inside. Pot lid is tin.
As you can see, this looks nothing like reenactor speckleware....
__________________
Kathryn Coombs
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 22nd, 2003 01:06 AM:
Mrs. Coombs,
I hope that your trip to the Arabia was all that you hoped for. Did you get to go into the back room and take a little closer inspection of the some of the artifacts? Your right that the pots look a lot like Le Creuset. I didn't know that they still made pots though. I have only seen pictures on e-bay (this certainly is all knew to me). I wonder if there is a way of getting the outside enamel off. There must be, as enamel (at least in my experience) seems easily cracked and worn. Does any one know of a way?
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by KLCoombs on July 23rd, 2003 08:55 AM:
Le Creuset
I've got Le Creuset pots (for modern cooking). They are very high quality and it would take a lot of bashing with a hammer and chisel to get the exterior enamel off and you'd never get it ALL off. And as they come in colors like bright blue, flame orange, hunter green, etc that wouldn't look right. Plus they're grotesquely expensive. Spending $200 on a large pot that you'll then have to whack with a hammer for months doesn't sound like much of a plan, IMHO
When I was in Poland about 10 years ago, I saw very similar enamelware -- cast iron on the outside, white enamel inside, in the Sava deparment store in Warsaw, so similar stuff was being made in Eastern Europe until quite recently and might still be being made
__________________
Kathryn Coombs
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Spinster on July 23rd, 2003 04:46 PM:
Make do or do without......
For good results on certain dyestuffs, an enameled pot is the most efficient thing to use, short of gleaming and expensive stainless steel.
Since I demonstrate a lot, I solved the enameled exterior problem on modern pots commercially available by painting the exterior with black engine paint. This painted coating mimics the sheet iron exterior once both have hung over the fire. It is heat resistant since its used to paint engines, and tends to last about a year under the heavy use that I give a dyepot. It helps to hold the paint, if you rough up the exterior enamel with some really harsh sandpaper, and I always repaint on a really hot day.
Of course, you've still got to deal with whether the underlying pot has a period shape---every once in awhile, I'll find one that fits the bill at an import shop or yard sale, and mend the sometimes cracked interior coating with heat resistant appliance paint. Remember that I'm dyeing in these, not cooking.
But unless you have a real need for the enamel interior, its an awful lot of trouble to go to--if you just want this for cooking, I'd really go with the Osman sheet kettles or some similar item made for civilian use by the various tinsmiths.
__________________
Mrs. Lawson
"Weaver, Spinster, Strong Fast Dyes"
(Terre Lawson,Civilian Coordinator, First Confederate Legion)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 24th, 2003 12:46 AM:
the paint idea is interesting. I am not going to be using the pot for cooking. Actually I am using it for soap, so the enamel is prety important. Also, could you just snd the outside enamel competely off?
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Linda Trent on July 24th, 2003 03:23 AM:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by JHuether
Actually I am using it for soap, so the enamel is prety important.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jason,
Why not just use iron kettles?
The Kentucky Housewife, 1839 p. 440
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ashes that are taken off the hearth every morning, are not good for soap, as the lye is sure to be weak. Without good strong lye it is in vain to try to make good soap, for in every attempt there will be a failure. To have good lye, the ashes should be burnt thoroughly, and kept as clean as possible. When it has dripped from the gum, put it in a large iron pot or kettle
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Linda
__________________
Linda Trent
lindatrent@zoomnet.net
struggleforstatehood.homestead.com/index.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 24th, 2003 02:16 PM:
Linda,
I have thought of using an iron pot, but right now I am just exploring options. I won't be doing to impression for more than a year from now, so I figure I have to time to work on the details. Thanks for the quote, I hadn't read that one. Gives some useful tips on lye dripping.
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Jack Enright on July 24th, 2003 06:02 PM:
Enamelware
Dear Jason,
I think you're confusing when the enamelware process was first patented with when it came into common use.
According to the Columbia Rifles Handbook,
"Enamelling was first patented in England in 1779, and for more than ninety years afterward inventors in both England and the United States worked to refine the process, which remained more-or-less experimental until the 1870s. Enamelware was first advertised for sale in the United States in 1874, but was not popularly introduced to the public until the Philadelphia Centennial Exposition in 1876—a full eleven years after the conclusion of the Civil War."
As with many new technologies, doing a small test piece in a lab was one thing; commercial mass production was something else entirely. Did you know that the first solid state rectifiers were made in the 19th century? I kid you not!
Hope this helps.
Jack Enright
24th MI Vol Inf (UK)
__________________
Jack Enright
24th MI Vol (UK)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Hank Trent on July 24th, 2003 08:01 PM:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
which remained more-or-less experimental until the 1870s. Enamelware was first advertised for sale in the United States in 1874, but was not popularly introduced to the public until the Philadelphia Centennial Exposition in 1876—a full eleven years after the conclusion of the Civil War.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What's the citation for that information? Aside from the obvious example of enamelware on the Arabia steamboat, here are some more examples showing porcelain enamelware was in common use during and prior to the war, but as I said earlier, primarily for preserving kettles:
"The introduction of iron ware lined with porcelain has fortunately almost superseded the use of brass or bell-metal kettles for boiling sweetmeats..." (Miss Leslie's Directions for Cookery, Eliza Leslie, 1851)
[For making preserved peaches] "The best preserving kettles are made of iron, and lined with porcelain." (The Kentucky Housewife, Lettice Bryan, 1839)
"An iron kettle lined with porcelain is the best for preserving..."
"To Clarify Sugar. Break up two pounds of loaf sugar; put it into a porcelain saucepan..."
"Marmalades and Jams... an iron porcelained kettle as for preserving must be used..." (Mrs. Goodfellow's Cookery as it Should Be, 1865)
"A new species of food for army uses, called the extract of flesh, is highly commended for invalid soldiers and others... An ordinary porcelain lined kettle, holding a gallon, is sufficient for the preparation of the extract." (CHARLESTON MERCURY, July 16, 1863, p. 1, c. 5)
Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net
__________________
.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Linda Trent on July 24th, 2003 08:15 PM:
Period soap making
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by JHuether
Linda,
I have thought of using an iron pot, but right now I am just exploring options. I won't be doing to impression for more than a year from now, so I figure I have to time to work on the details. Thanks for the quote, I hadn't read that one. Gives some useful tips on lye dripping.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi Jason,
I don't know how much research you've put into soap making, and the various techniques and receipts, but I have gone through all our period cookery books and such and wrote out all the receipts. Have you ever thought about making soft soap? It seems like it would have been the most typical form of homemade soap.
The main difference between soft soap and hard (or bar) soap is that the hard soap contains salt. Most modern lye is sodium lye, which will cause a hard soap. But there are a few places that do carry potassium lye (which was what appears to be the most common form of lye in the CW era and before). You will notice that the majority of receipts are for soft soap.
For the different period soap receipts you can go to:
http://thebradfordplace1863.homestea...oapMaking.html the receipts are pretty much listed in reverse chronological order, with the Virginia Housewife at the end since even though my edition is dated 1860, the first edition was in the 1820's, and the receipts appear to be mostly unchanged from the first edition.
Unfortunately, most of the receipts don't mention the type of pot / kettle necessary, except for the KY Housewife. But you still might find more info in other areas. Enjoy!
Linda
__________________
Linda Trent
lindatrent@zoomnet.net
struggleforstatehood.homestead.com/index.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 25th, 2003 12:04 AM:
Period soap making
Linda,
Actually I am just getting into soft soap. One of the things that got me most interested in making soap was an article i found in the "Liberty Tribune" dated October 10, 1862 (4/1). The article is titled "Soft Soap."Mainly it details the process of lye dripping. This is the process of creating a lye solution by running water throughhardwood ashes. It actually says to add salt if hard soap is desired. They test the lye by tasting it. Mostly I have read by touching it to the tongue. A sharp burn is the sign of a strong mixture. This article also mentions if the soap boils up in a black color the lye is strong enough. I have never used this latter method.
I have never found where to get potassium based lye. I would like to as I saw a recipe for soft soap from 1862 (I believe that date is right). It uses a pound of concentrated lye. Do you know where I could find some?
Thanks.
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Hank Trent on July 25th, 2003 12:37 AM:
Try a google search for "potassium lye" or "potassium hydroxide," and you'll find mail order places that sell it. A couple of the first ones that showed up were http://pawmadesoap.safeshopper.com/86/835.htm?244 and http://www.snowdriftfarm.com/dry.html
Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net
__________________
.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Linda Mount on July 25th, 2003 03:12 AM:
Hi Jason and everyone...
Liquid soap was not necessarily made on purpose. When lye was originally home created by dripping water through wood ashes, the concentration would vary greatly. The less concentrated the lye, the more likely you were to have soap that wouldn't set properly ie. soft soap. You could test the quality of your lye by floating an egg in it. If the egg sunk or set on top, then the lye was not correct. If the egg floated about "halfway" , you were OK and your soap might set. Water quality was/is important, too. Good, soft water--they collected rain water-- is always best. Good luck.
__________________
Linda Mount
Confederate Civilian (displaced)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by KLCoombs on July 25th, 2003 05:00 AM:
enamelware
If one wanted to reproduce the look of these pots on the Arabia, it occurs to me that it might be easier to find an artisan who could enamel the inside of a cast iron pot than it would be to attempt to remove or cover up the exterior enamel on an already enameled pot.
I don't know where one would find such a person or how the process works, but an intensive search on Google or on the vendor directories that the various historic house restoration websites have might yield something useful. I'm presuming it involves using a kiln sufficiently hot to bake the enamel on but not hot enough to melt the cast iron...
__________________
Kathryn Coombs
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by KLCoombs on July 25th, 2003 05:01 AM:
ps
wondering if those folks who re-enamel old cast iron bathtubs or sinks might be useful in this regard.... And whether the process they use would produce an interior that was food-safe. Last time I had a bathtub reenameled it was ca. $250 for a whole bathtub, so on this basis, it might not cost too much to get one pot done.
__________________
Kathryn Coombs
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Jack Enright on July 25th, 2003 01:19 PM:
Quote from Columbia Rifles Handbook
Dear Hank,
ref. citation for the quote:-
I can't check on that for you at the moment, as I'm at work (and my copy of the handbook is at home), but will do so this weekend. I'm travelling around for job interviews over the next couple of days, but will post what I find on Tuesday - the first chance I'll have.
This is obviously important, as, from what I remember, other dating info I've seen has referred to 'speckled-ware', rather than plain colours. I'm now wondering if the post-war dating only applies to speckled-ware, rather than all enamelware.
And this especially matters to re-enactors on this side of the Atlantic, where we only have access to very limited amounts of original artifacts and documentary evidence.
I'll be in touch, and best regards,
Jack Enright
24th MI Vol Inf (UK)
__________________
Jack Enright
24th MI Vol (UK)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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John Taylor
Show all 20 posts from this thread on one page
The Authentic Campaigner Forums
- General Discussion: Authentic Citizenry and Civilians
-- Period enamel-ware pots
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 19th, 2003 11:06 PM:
Period enamel-ware pots
Does anyone have any inforamtion on enamel-ware during the 1850s and 60s. I know that it was first used in the 1790s, but remained largely unused until late in the 19th century. More impportantly does anyone know where I could get a large enamel pot (at least 5 qts).
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Hank Trent on July 20th, 2003 04:43 AM:
Actually, I've found quite a bit of evidence of enamelware being used in the mid 19th century in period cookbooks--but it's almost always mentioned as being used as a preserving kettle for jellies and such.
There's some enamelware at the Arabia museum, and it's typical of the period stuff--a white coating, on the inside of the container only, and on what appears to be cast iron rather than on sheet metal.
Where can you get it today? I have no idea. Somewhere it exists, though, because on one of the earlier Survivor shows, there was a nice close-up shot of them cooking in what appeared to be a period-style cast iron pot with a white enamel lining. I'm figuring that third-world countries might still be making them, but I have no clue how to find one.
Edited to add: It's probably not in usable condition, but here's an example of the white-on-the-inside-of-cast-iron kind of enamelware on eBay right now: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...&category=4708 . Don't know if that piece is truly period. It would help to see the bottom to see if there's a gate mark, and somebody more knowledgeable could probably date it by the shape of the bale holders. But it gives you an idea.
Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net
__________________
.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by KLCoombs on July 20th, 2003 04:23 PM:
Arabia enamelware
woo hoo -- finally going to the Arabia -- flew to Kansas City yesterday and leaving to drive to museum in a few minutes. Am bringing digital camera of course. If I can get a good shot of the enamelware, I'll post it here.
__________________
Kathryn Coombs
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 20th, 2003 05:04 PM:
Thanks for the info. I completely forgot about the Arabia. I used to live right down the road from the museum, and have been there many times. I didn't recall any enamel-ware, but your post made me go digging through old pistures and sure enough I have a few. Thanks for the help.
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by KLCoombs on July 21st, 2003 07:59 AM:
Enamelware on the Arabia
As promised....
[IMG]bigenamelpot.jpeg[/IMG]
large cast iron enamel pot from the Steamship Arabia cargo. As Hank noted, it is enameled on the inside only. The general look is similar to modern-day Le Creuset, only without the colored enamel on the outside.
[IMG]smallenamelpot.jpeg[/IMG]
Enamelware saucepan from the Arabia. Also enameled only on the inside. Pot lid is tin.
As you can see, this looks nothing like reenactor speckleware....
__________________
Kathryn Coombs
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 22nd, 2003 01:06 AM:
Mrs. Coombs,
I hope that your trip to the Arabia was all that you hoped for. Did you get to go into the back room and take a little closer inspection of the some of the artifacts? Your right that the pots look a lot like Le Creuset. I didn't know that they still made pots though. I have only seen pictures on e-bay (this certainly is all knew to me). I wonder if there is a way of getting the outside enamel off. There must be, as enamel (at least in my experience) seems easily cracked and worn. Does any one know of a way?
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by KLCoombs on July 23rd, 2003 08:55 AM:
Le Creuset
I've got Le Creuset pots (for modern cooking). They are very high quality and it would take a lot of bashing with a hammer and chisel to get the exterior enamel off and you'd never get it ALL off. And as they come in colors like bright blue, flame orange, hunter green, etc that wouldn't look right. Plus they're grotesquely expensive. Spending $200 on a large pot that you'll then have to whack with a hammer for months doesn't sound like much of a plan, IMHO
When I was in Poland about 10 years ago, I saw very similar enamelware -- cast iron on the outside, white enamel inside, in the Sava deparment store in Warsaw, so similar stuff was being made in Eastern Europe until quite recently and might still be being made
__________________
Kathryn Coombs
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Spinster on July 23rd, 2003 04:46 PM:
Make do or do without......
For good results on certain dyestuffs, an enameled pot is the most efficient thing to use, short of gleaming and expensive stainless steel.
Since I demonstrate a lot, I solved the enameled exterior problem on modern pots commercially available by painting the exterior with black engine paint. This painted coating mimics the sheet iron exterior once both have hung over the fire. It is heat resistant since its used to paint engines, and tends to last about a year under the heavy use that I give a dyepot. It helps to hold the paint, if you rough up the exterior enamel with some really harsh sandpaper, and I always repaint on a really hot day.
Of course, you've still got to deal with whether the underlying pot has a period shape---every once in awhile, I'll find one that fits the bill at an import shop or yard sale, and mend the sometimes cracked interior coating with heat resistant appliance paint. Remember that I'm dyeing in these, not cooking.
But unless you have a real need for the enamel interior, its an awful lot of trouble to go to--if you just want this for cooking, I'd really go with the Osman sheet kettles or some similar item made for civilian use by the various tinsmiths.
__________________
Mrs. Lawson
"Weaver, Spinster, Strong Fast Dyes"
(Terre Lawson,Civilian Coordinator, First Confederate Legion)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 24th, 2003 12:46 AM:
the paint idea is interesting. I am not going to be using the pot for cooking. Actually I am using it for soap, so the enamel is prety important. Also, could you just snd the outside enamel competely off?
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Linda Trent on July 24th, 2003 03:23 AM:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by JHuether
Actually I am using it for soap, so the enamel is prety important.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jason,
Why not just use iron kettles?
The Kentucky Housewife, 1839 p. 440
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ashes that are taken off the hearth every morning, are not good for soap, as the lye is sure to be weak. Without good strong lye it is in vain to try to make good soap, for in every attempt there will be a failure. To have good lye, the ashes should be burnt thoroughly, and kept as clean as possible. When it has dripped from the gum, put it in a large iron pot or kettle
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Linda
__________________
Linda Trent
lindatrent@zoomnet.net
struggleforstatehood.homestead.com/index.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 24th, 2003 02:16 PM:
Linda,
I have thought of using an iron pot, but right now I am just exploring options. I won't be doing to impression for more than a year from now, so I figure I have to time to work on the details. Thanks for the quote, I hadn't read that one. Gives some useful tips on lye dripping.
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Jack Enright on July 24th, 2003 06:02 PM:
Enamelware
Dear Jason,
I think you're confusing when the enamelware process was first patented with when it came into common use.
According to the Columbia Rifles Handbook,
"Enamelling was first patented in England in 1779, and for more than ninety years afterward inventors in both England and the United States worked to refine the process, which remained more-or-less experimental until the 1870s. Enamelware was first advertised for sale in the United States in 1874, but was not popularly introduced to the public until the Philadelphia Centennial Exposition in 1876—a full eleven years after the conclusion of the Civil War."
As with many new technologies, doing a small test piece in a lab was one thing; commercial mass production was something else entirely. Did you know that the first solid state rectifiers were made in the 19th century? I kid you not!
Hope this helps.
Jack Enright
24th MI Vol Inf (UK)
__________________
Jack Enright
24th MI Vol (UK)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Hank Trent on July 24th, 2003 08:01 PM:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
which remained more-or-less experimental until the 1870s. Enamelware was first advertised for sale in the United States in 1874, but was not popularly introduced to the public until the Philadelphia Centennial Exposition in 1876—a full eleven years after the conclusion of the Civil War.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What's the citation for that information? Aside from the obvious example of enamelware on the Arabia steamboat, here are some more examples showing porcelain enamelware was in common use during and prior to the war, but as I said earlier, primarily for preserving kettles:
"The introduction of iron ware lined with porcelain has fortunately almost superseded the use of brass or bell-metal kettles for boiling sweetmeats..." (Miss Leslie's Directions for Cookery, Eliza Leslie, 1851)
[For making preserved peaches] "The best preserving kettles are made of iron, and lined with porcelain." (The Kentucky Housewife, Lettice Bryan, 1839)
"An iron kettle lined with porcelain is the best for preserving..."
"To Clarify Sugar. Break up two pounds of loaf sugar; put it into a porcelain saucepan..."
"Marmalades and Jams... an iron porcelained kettle as for preserving must be used..." (Mrs. Goodfellow's Cookery as it Should Be, 1865)
"A new species of food for army uses, called the extract of flesh, is highly commended for invalid soldiers and others... An ordinary porcelain lined kettle, holding a gallon, is sufficient for the preparation of the extract." (CHARLESTON MERCURY, July 16, 1863, p. 1, c. 5)
Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net
__________________
.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Linda Trent on July 24th, 2003 08:15 PM:
Period soap making
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by JHuether
Linda,
I have thought of using an iron pot, but right now I am just exploring options. I won't be doing to impression for more than a year from now, so I figure I have to time to work on the details. Thanks for the quote, I hadn't read that one. Gives some useful tips on lye dripping.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi Jason,
I don't know how much research you've put into soap making, and the various techniques and receipts, but I have gone through all our period cookery books and such and wrote out all the receipts. Have you ever thought about making soft soap? It seems like it would have been the most typical form of homemade soap.
The main difference between soft soap and hard (or bar) soap is that the hard soap contains salt. Most modern lye is sodium lye, which will cause a hard soap. But there are a few places that do carry potassium lye (which was what appears to be the most common form of lye in the CW era and before). You will notice that the majority of receipts are for soft soap.
For the different period soap receipts you can go to:
http://thebradfordplace1863.homestea...oapMaking.html the receipts are pretty much listed in reverse chronological order, with the Virginia Housewife at the end since even though my edition is dated 1860, the first edition was in the 1820's, and the receipts appear to be mostly unchanged from the first edition.
Unfortunately, most of the receipts don't mention the type of pot / kettle necessary, except for the KY Housewife. But you still might find more info in other areas. Enjoy!
Linda
__________________
Linda Trent
lindatrent@zoomnet.net
struggleforstatehood.homestead.com/index.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JHuether on July 25th, 2003 12:04 AM:
Period soap making
Linda,
Actually I am just getting into soft soap. One of the things that got me most interested in making soap was an article i found in the "Liberty Tribune" dated October 10, 1862 (4/1). The article is titled "Soft Soap."Mainly it details the process of lye dripping. This is the process of creating a lye solution by running water throughhardwood ashes. It actually says to add salt if hard soap is desired. They test the lye by tasting it. Mostly I have read by touching it to the tongue. A sharp burn is the sign of a strong mixture. This article also mentions if the soap boils up in a black color the lye is strong enough. I have never used this latter method.
I have never found where to get potassium based lye. I would like to as I saw a recipe for soft soap from 1862 (I believe that date is right). It uses a pound of concentrated lye. Do you know where I could find some?
Thanks.
__________________
Jason Huether
Lazy Skinners Society
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Hank Trent on July 25th, 2003 12:37 AM:
Try a google search for "potassium lye" or "potassium hydroxide," and you'll find mail order places that sell it. A couple of the first ones that showed up were http://pawmadesoap.safeshopper.com/86/835.htm?244 and http://www.snowdriftfarm.com/dry.html
Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net
__________________
.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Linda Mount on July 25th, 2003 03:12 AM:
Hi Jason and everyone...
Liquid soap was not necessarily made on purpose. When lye was originally home created by dripping water through wood ashes, the concentration would vary greatly. The less concentrated the lye, the more likely you were to have soap that wouldn't set properly ie. soft soap. You could test the quality of your lye by floating an egg in it. If the egg sunk or set on top, then the lye was not correct. If the egg floated about "halfway" , you were OK and your soap might set. Water quality was/is important, too. Good, soft water--they collected rain water-- is always best. Good luck.
__________________
Linda Mount
Confederate Civilian (displaced)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by KLCoombs on July 25th, 2003 05:00 AM:
enamelware
If one wanted to reproduce the look of these pots on the Arabia, it occurs to me that it might be easier to find an artisan who could enamel the inside of a cast iron pot than it would be to attempt to remove or cover up the exterior enamel on an already enameled pot.
I don't know where one would find such a person or how the process works, but an intensive search on Google or on the vendor directories that the various historic house restoration websites have might yield something useful. I'm presuming it involves using a kiln sufficiently hot to bake the enamel on but not hot enough to melt the cast iron...
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Kathryn Coombs
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Posted by KLCoombs on July 25th, 2003 05:01 AM:
ps
wondering if those folks who re-enamel old cast iron bathtubs or sinks might be useful in this regard.... And whether the process they use would produce an interior that was food-safe. Last time I had a bathtub reenameled it was ca. $250 for a whole bathtub, so on this basis, it might not cost too much to get one pot done.
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Kathryn Coombs
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Posted by Jack Enright on July 25th, 2003 01:19 PM:
Quote from Columbia Rifles Handbook
Dear Hank,
ref. citation for the quote:-
I can't check on that for you at the moment, as I'm at work (and my copy of the handbook is at home), but will do so this weekend. I'm travelling around for job interviews over the next couple of days, but will post what I find on Tuesday - the first chance I'll have.
This is obviously important, as, from what I remember, other dating info I've seen has referred to 'speckled-ware', rather than plain colours. I'm now wondering if the post-war dating only applies to speckled-ware, rather than all enamelware.
And this especially matters to re-enactors on this side of the Atlantic, where we only have access to very limited amounts of original artifacts and documentary evidence.
I'll be in touch, and best regards,
Jack Enright
24th MI Vol Inf (UK)
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Jack Enright
24th MI Vol (UK)
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