Norfolk Shirt, 1866

[Canton Zouave]

I have been looking at a new book that I have acquired.

The book "Civil War Gentlemen: 1860's Apparel Arts & Uniforms" by R.L. Shep.

The book, for those who have not seen it, goes into detail about the Salisbury System of Tailoring.

In the shirt section it speaks of the "Norfolk Pattern" Shirt, and provides a pattern of this type of shirt.

I thought I would put some feelers out, to see if anyone had reproduced such a shirt, or have come across original specimens in this style.

The pattern originally apeared in the West End Gazette, in 1866.

The shirt appears to have a full open front placket, as opposed to the common, pull over type shirt with placket.

Any thoughts on this type of shirt?

The original article speaks about the shirt being a nice full shirt that would wear well, and would be "a becoming garment for young gentlemen when made either in unbleached brown Holland, Alpaca, or Tweed..."


As a side note: The book has been a great aid in my study of period tailoring.

[Drygoods]

Re: Norfolk Shirt, 1866

Greetings Mr. Todd,

I found the same style shirt in another Shep book called Shirts & Men's Haberdashery 1840-1920s and the date that they had for the Norfolk Shirt is 1870. Who knows it may have been a popular style, but I can say one thing that I do not like about the shirt is the dip in the back yoke and also that the sleeves look too narrow. The patterns shows to be an almost 18 inch sleeve width along with taking the seam allowance into account. Fuller sleeve caps look nicer to me.

Another good book for shirts is Thoughts On Men's Shirts In America 1750-1900 by William Brown III.

I thought that I had a copy of the book that you mentioned but as I couldn't find it in the shop, it's either checked out or misplaced on the shelf. I'll write another 3 cents if I can find the book this afternoon.

Mfr,
Judith Peebles

[Canton Zouave]

Re: Norfolk Shirt, 1866

Judith,

"Thougths on Men's Shirts" is an excellent reference. I am on my second copy. On top of that, Bill Brown has been an excellent source for my research into period shirts. We have spoke several times about various shirts he has examined, and he has been a world of help in my own patterning work. (Not that On The Square Shirts are hard to pattern).

In Civil War Gentlemen, the Norfolk Shirt appears in both Article and Pattern form. It is an excerpt from the West End Gazette, and is dated 1866. There is also a reference to the 1870 article as well. I am looking to see if I can find an earlier reference.

The pattern from 1866 shows Plaits down the front and back of the shirt, but no yoke. These plates obviously add decoration, and close in the collar for the appropriate size. The one thing mentioned that doesnt appear in the pattern, is a belt used to close the bottom of the shirt.


The one intersting aspect of this book is the fact that it gives in some detail a method fro adjusting the scye of the shirt using two rulers. It should be an intersting technique to work with, and figure out.

[markj]

Re: Norfolk Shirt, 1866

Greetings,

Since we're talking about shirts, here are two scans some of you might enjoy. The illustrated pattern comes from the April 1857 "Godey's Lady's Book." The second scan, describing how to properly fit and make men's shirts, comes from the June 1858 "Godey's." Viewers may have to zoom in on one or both scans to ensure legibility.

I had a professional seamstress look at the 1857 pattern but she had trouble making sense out of it. If anyone else has tried making this item, I'd be interested to hear about their experiences.

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[Canton Zouave]

Re: Norfolk Shirt, 1866

Mark,

I still have that pattern from a post we did once before, and have still to figure it out. I guess it is just a matter of setting down, cutting it out and piecing it together....until it looks right. I believe Hank Trent pointed out one time...about the neck binding, and it's size. After looking it over briefly, it looks like something is missing.

I am always in search for something new, and different. Thus, the Norfolk shirt, add to that the one you have posted. As it stands, I have about 6 differnet shirts that I could pattern to date, and I am still looking for more.

[Canton Zouave]

Re: Norfolk Shirt, 1866

Mark and the rest of yuns,

Here is my attempt at some paperwork. I took the pattern that Mark post and with the help of a little binding tape....here we go.


The major probelm I have discovered with the pattern is the fact that the pieces are not all scaled the same. This may be why it doesnt seem to got together correctly.

I have included a couple of images of my efforts. The pics may not be that good. Color coding may have helped to distinguish the parts of the pattern.


This shirt pattern is very similar to one of the shirts that I examined in the collection of the Gettysburg NMP.

[markj]

Re: Norfolk Shirt, 1866

Hi Todd,

Interesting work there! Probably one reason why the pattern may seem confusing to us today is because "Godey's" largely assumed its readership already had a good grasp about shirt-making and, thus, didn't need really detailed information to make the item in question. Or, if they did need assistance, they could readily get it from a more experienced family member, merchant tailor, or local seamstress.

The Indiana Sanitary Commission alone is known to have shipped over 30,000 shirts to various locations during the war so, obviously, the good ladies of Hoosierdom were no slouches in the "shirtmaking department."

Regards,

Mark Jaeger