Hamp Maker?

[turfwriter]

Does anyone have any idea what a "hamp maker" does?

My gggrandfather (who was actually a shoemaker by trade) apparently performed this role for his brigade, and I have seen references to hamp makers in censuses of the period, but have yet to come across a definition.

Many thanks,
Laurel Scott
Union Bridge, MD

[Army30th]

Re: Hamp Maker?

I'll take a stab and say a person that makes rope. That's all I can think of.

[gweninla]

Re: Hamp Maker?

http://www.vcdh.virginia.edu/afam/raceandplace/census/all_occs.html

List of trades, including Hamp maker. Could hamp be hemp?

Gwen in l.a.
conjecturing

[Hank Trent]

Re: Hamp Maker?

Does anyone have any idea what a "hamp maker" does?

My gggrandfather (who was actually a shoemaker by trade) apparently performed this role for his brigade, and I have seen references to hamp makers in censuses of the period, but have yet to come across a definition.

First thing that occurs to me is, are you seeing it spelled "hamp maker" in type set at the time? Or are you looking at it handwritten or transcribed by someone much later?

If there's a chance the original handwriting could have been misread...

Since he made shoes, he worked with leather, and there was a position called "harness maker." Google "detailed as harness maker" to see.

Here's how harness could be read as hamp. The ha is obvious. The rn looks like an m. The e gets lost or ignored as just a squiggle. And it's common for modern folks to misread a long s and a regular s as an old-fashioned p with a high ascender, because the long s forms the back of the "p" and the regular s forms the circle of the p. Thus harnfs maker becomes hamp maker.

Just a thought. You can see if it would fit the circumstances.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

[Virginia Mescher]

Re: Hamp Maker?

Does anyone have any idea what a "hamp maker" does?

My gggrandfather (who was actually a shoemaker by trade) apparently performed this role for his brigade, and I have seen references to hamp makers in censuses of the period, but have yet to come across a definition.

Many thanks,
Laurel Scott
Union Bridge, MD

One of the definitions of "hamper" given, in my 1861 Webster's, was "shackles."

I could not find the word "hamp" in any dictionary, either period or modern but did find "hamp maker" appearing in list of occupations from the mid-19th century on into the early 20th century. It would seem odd that "hemp" was misspelled so many times and I did not see hamp-maker used in any context with rope makers, although some rope was made with hemp.

I ran into problems searching because everything with "hamp" such as New Hampshire, Hampton, and the name, Hamp came up so I got lots of hits for the word. I didn't have time to check each one out.

[Justin Runyon]

Re: Hamp Maker?

I too have looked everywhere and ran into the same results as Virginia. I'm honestly not sure what a hamp maker is but Hanks post got me to thinking. While researching last night I ran across a German occupational name that is strikingly similar to "hamp maker". I forget the original German right now (I feel shame after taking years of German that I forgot this one word in 12 hours) but suffice to say that it translated to a harness or halter maker. Who knows.

[Hank Trent]

Re: Hamp Maker?

Since nobody's definitely solved this one yet, I thought I'd look into my theory a bit more. I googled for "hamp maker" and "harness maker" together, found them in the 1850 Montgomery Alabama census, then went to look at those actual census images on Ancestry.com. If you want to play along, I used this page of transcriptions from the google search: http://www.rootsweb.com/~cenfiles/al...3/pg0w3-01.txt

To find J.W. Nettleton the hamp maker, who coincidentally is right near M. Thomas the "hamo maker," search for T.W. Nettleton in the 1850 census on Ancestry.com, if you have a subscription. Ancestry transcribed his first initial differently.

On the original census image, both "hamo maker" and "hamp maker" look just like "harnefs maker" to me, with a long s. You can plainly see the e in there, between harn and fs. (I'm typing an f for the long s, because I don't think a long s is available to type in this font.)

Skip over to Ancestry's page 9 of 26, to see Jos. M. Ealy, whose occupation the rootsweb page transcribes as "harness maker." It's written the same way as the words that were transcribed as "hamo maker" and "hamp maker," with a long s. If there's any doubt the census taker was using a long s, Ealy's state of birth was Mafs.

I really think "harness maker" is the answer.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

[turfwriter]

Re: Hamp Maker?

Wow -- those are all WONDERFUL replies, and I really appreciate all the brainstorming! :D

My first thought was the same as yours, Hank -- that this must be some misspelling of or abbreviation for harness maker, since that seems a logical jump from shoemaker.

However, the handwriting on this particular military record is unusually clear, and everyone who's seen it believes it says "hamp maker" in no uncertain terms. Then, too, Like Virginia notes, it seems rather odd that "harness" became "hamp" in so many census records and occupational records of the period. Kind of an odd abbreviation, at the very least.

My gggrandfather, who was a private in the 2nd NJ Vols., also served "extra duty" as a nurse, apparently ... not sure if that helps at all.

Many thanks,
Laurel Scott

[Hank Trent]

Re: Hamp Maker?

So it is in original handwriting, and not typeset. Do you have a way to scan and post it, so we can take a look at it?

Then, too, Like Virginia notes, it seems rather odd that "harness" became "hamp" in so many census records and occupational records of the period. Kind of an odd abbreviation, at the very least.

Just to clarify, I'm not proposing it's an abbreviation or a misspelling. I'm saying it's a mistaken reading, by modern people, of the correctly written period word "harnefs maker" (with a long s), because modern people aren't used to recognizing old handwriting and are additionally not expecting the long s.

So far, examples of "hamp maker" in unmistakable type have only been presented in modern transcriptions of census records, not in lists of occupations type-set at the time. There are only 16 hits in google for the phrase, so that's hardly a lot, and many of them have question marks following, as if the transcriber was unsure.

If it was indeed a period phrase or abbreviation, seems the first step to proving that is to find examples of it in period type.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

[turfwriter]

Re: Hamp Maker?

Thanks, Hank. Yes, I understand what you're saying -- but comparing the "s"s, "m"s and "p"s to others in this same document (which are all very clear), I suspect it's more likely an abbrieviation than a misreading of the handwriting. Still, I'm open to suggestion! :)

Unfortunately, I just switched PCs, and my scanner will not work with my new OS (too old, no drivers). However, I can probably scan this at my office either Monday or Tuesday. So please stay tuned!!

And thanks again for your help.

Laurel Scott

[turfwriter]

Re: Hamp Maker?

Sorry -- I meant "n"s, not "m"s. There are no lowercase "m"s in this doc to use for comparison purposes.

Yes, I can see how it could be "harness," if it weren't for that last letter, which looks for all the world like the other "p" in this doc!

But I will post it as soon as I can, so you can see. :)

Thanks again,
Laurel Scott

[Justin Runyon]

Re: Hamp Maker?

Posted for Laurel Scott:

[Justin Runyon]

Re: Hamp Maker?

Now that I've seen it, my vote is certainly for Harnefs maker. No wonder Hamp turned up nothing.

[Hank Trent]

Re: Hamp Maker?

Wow, look at the different way the letters are made. Is that all written by Reynolds the copyist? There are two kinds of e's, the greek three-pronged e in Henry and the loop e elsewhere. And the r's in Henry and present are formed different than the r's in Trenton and Brig'd.

But I agree with Justin, it looks like harnefs maker. The r in harness is formed the same way as the r in maker, you can see the n, then the tiny closed loop for the e that matches the tiny closed e in maker, then the long s and the regular s.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

[turfwriter]

Re: Hamp Maker?

Heehee! I think our man Reynolds was perhaps a little tired by the time he got to this record, although his penmanship certainly outstrips mine on my best days. :)

Well, I'm relieved that ya'll have arrived at a consensus of sorts, although that one dangling "s" still throws me! It seems strange that "harness" was misread as "hamp" on so many occasions in the census and other docs, but hey, I'll buy it -- especially given ol' Henry's chosen occupation.

Thanks a million for your help, everyone!

Laurel Scott