Mid-19th Century Religion

[ElizabethClark]

At member request, let's open up a polite, coherent, research-based discussion on historic religion in the context of the mid-19th century. If you have questions about how a particular sect might have handled something, or how a person of religious persuasion might be regarded in society, or fit into the larger social context, this would be a good place to ask.

Religion *can* be a touchy subject, but it doesn't need to be. Let's keep to these discussion ground rules, which are consistent with the AC Forum rules:

1: Keep it Historic. Religious dogma, tenets, and culture do change over time, and we're not interested in anything past 1866.

2: Keep it Neutral. We're discussing the past. Nothing that anyone did or didn't do in the mid-19th century has any bearing on your own personal faith today. It is entirely possible to have calm discussion of controversial historic religious aspects.

3: No Witnessing. This is not the thread for urging people toward your particular faith, or sharing faith/conversion stories. That would be "MODERN" religion... see Rule 1.

4: No Bashing. Yes, we may touch on unsavory aspects of mid-19th century religious observance (or lack thereof.) But since we're discussing history, not personal faith, this won't be a problem, right?

So, folks, keep it clean and civil and back up your thoughts with historic documentation. "I think they would have" won't work. :) If your comments cross the line from the rules, they will be edited or removed, to keep the focus of the discussion intact.

What shall we discuss first?

[Fiddlebum]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

I'd like to know to what extent 19th century Americans were aware of Eastern religions. If anyone can point me to some sources I'd appreciate it very much.

Thanks,

Kim Caudell

[ElizabethClark]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

Kim, any particular philosophy you want to look at? Godeys and Petersons did publish some good stories/articles/travelogues that incorporated "exotic" locales such as India and China, and those often include some cultural and religious characters in the narrative. Adding in foreign mission work undertaken by many US Christian religions, and the potential for at least a passing knowledge of the Far East expands.

However, I'm not hitting good keywords on Google Books today... which is frustrating. Lunch first, then Google.

[styler]

Idiom

My 2 cents: Want to improve your impression? If you're portraying someone of a Protestant ilk memorize as much of the King James Version of the Bible as you can. Knowing and being able to quote the words will on its own bring you leaps and bounds above most portrayals out there.

The KJV was the most influential bit of literature in America in the 1860s. Religious beliefs aside, it was about as close to universally known as anything. While Catholics and such didn't read the thing, there were enough sayings and phrases in common usage taken from the KJV that they would have been familiar with passages from it.

Just my humble opinion, mind you.

[ElizabethClark]

Re: Idiom

Mr Tyler, would the "and such" after Catholics be referring to a specific set of non-Protestant sects? I can think of a few folks in the period who'd be familiar with the King James version, as either a holy text or historic text, but not be Protestant or Catholic: Mormons, Islamists, non-religious scholars or philosophers... Those are off the top of my head, but did you have others in mind that I've missed?

[nick19thind]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

I'd like to know to what extent 19th century Americans were aware of Eastern religions. If anyone can point me to some sources I'd appreciate it very much.

Thanks,

Kim Caudell

The Chinese workers who built America's railways were Buddhists and Taoists.
A couple of years back they found the grave of one of these immigrants in a program on Discovery.

[ElizabethClark]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

Nick, did the program happen to mention any percentages of Christianized Asians working the railways? Mission efforts with native populations and emigrant Asians in California, particularly, seem to have been pretty extensive in the middle of the century, based on summarizing a lot of reading on Gold Rush & westward migration topics.

[nick19thind]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

No, it was just about this one discovery. The worker was buried with his pigtail (something to do with traditional Chinese religious beliefs), some charms and in a traditional jacket worn with denim trousers.
I can't remember the name of the program, it might have been something like "mummy autopsy"

[styler]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

Actually, I was thinking of Jews. It may be arguable (in a period manner) concerning whether Unitarians, Universalists, Shakers, and Quakers were "Protestants." But certainly they, as well as Latter Day Saints (Mormons; much less accepted as Protestants in the 1860s than the previously mentioned groups, but, then, where did converts to that church come from?), would all know from use the KJV Bible (in addition to the Book of Mormon in the Saints' case).

I would like to make a clarification to my first post. Not everyone alive in America in the early 1860s was a scholar. Not everyone could read the Bible or had the Bible read to them. Not everyone went to church - some because of lack of opportunity, but many by choice. But nearly everyone heard or used some phrase or saying that came from the Bible, essentially the King James Version. As an example, in another forum I pointed out that the phrase "separating the wheat from the chaff" isn't just an old agricultural saying, it's also a biblically-based metaphor (Matthew 3:12, Luke 3:17, probably mixed with the sheep and goats from Matthew 25:31-33).

[ElizabethClark]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

Good point on the Biblical metaphors; those, and many classical literature references do tend to pepper mid-century vocabulary, and even if a person was not well-versed in the originating texts themselves, they would be familiar with the "pop culture" phrase itself.

On Mormons (LDS, Saints, Mormonites... lots of appropriate period terms), I've not found much from mid-century from the Mormons themselves to point toward them considering themselves Protestant. Rather, they believed their church to be a full restoration of the Early Church, not a protestant reformation of any kind. The line of the church also cannot be traced to Reformation sources... it starts with Joseph Smith, rather than any of the great Reformationists. So, from period information, I'd have to opine that the Mormons were not, in fact, Protestants, nor were they looking to be called or accepted as Protestants. Christian, yes. Protestant/Catholic, no.

Eastern Religions: I grew up in a gold town, where the main strike was discovered in 1862, and by 1863, the tiny valley had a population of nearly 10,000, with a thriving Chinese population. There were small shrine niches included in the main, fortified social building down in "China Town", which remained in place even during the long closure of the building once the boom was over. While the Chinese were heavily persecuted in this particular area, local whites respected some of the permanent residents who operated one of the few medical services (Chinese herbs and alcohol, mostly).

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

Hallo!

Just an aside...
The Chinese queue (or later derogatory "pigtail") was not religious. It was political.

When the Manchu invaded Han China in the early 17th century, and ended the Ming Dynasty to establish their own Qing Dynasty (1644-1912), "Queue Orders" were issued forcing the conquered Han males to shave the front of their heads and wear the queue as did the Manchu.
This was a combination of subjugation, but it also tended to identify those rebelling or resisting Manchu rule. In a genocide move, hundreds of thousands of men were executed for not converting to the "new hair style," as the penalty was death by beheading.

Perhaps not so oddly enough, what was initially subjugation, oppression, and enforced style in hair and clothing, became "assimilated" as "Chinese" male fashion/dress. However, when the Chinese Republic ended the Qing Dynasty in 1912, the fashion was reveresed- the cutting of the queue and wearing of short hair was seen as a distancing and rejecting of the old empire. (But some few continued to wear the queue for a few years because of entrenched tradition.)

Curt

[yankeecav]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

Keep in mind that while many people may not have been churchgoers a large number of those people that received instruction from public schools or used the same books in studies at home would have been exposed to biblical stories and contemporary moral stories using biblical principles.

I base this assertion on the various books used in american schools. The New England Primer was used for nearly 100 years until about the beginning of the 19th century. It was strongly oriented with the bible.

The NEP was then replaced in large part with Noah Websters The American Spelling Book. This book also had a strong biblical influence.

In the mid-1830s a very poular series called McGuffeys Reader (yes you have all heard of them) began to see widespread use.

My point is that while many may not go to church there is still a good chance that they would have had some exposure to biblical principles/morals.

I look forward to more dicscussion of this topic.

[Ga Boy]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

Ladies and Gentlemen
One book that has given me quite about of insight on the religious world of the Civil war soldier and civilian is "While God is Marching on the religious world of the civil war soldiers." Author is Steven E. Woodworth. Book is printed by Unversity of Kansas press. I think this will give you a very good idea of what part religion played in the soldiers life and how he looked at the world he lived in.

Jim Boone
47th Ga. V.I.

[amity]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

Here is some info on the religious demography of U.S. in 1850-60:

http://facweb.furman.edu/~benson/docs/h75rel.htm

The only religions thought "statistically significant" by whoever drew up this series of maps seem to be those we might have guessed, and no further denominational breakdowns are available on this website. The value of these maps is that it does show regional predominance of various denominations by county, albeit in a very cumbersome way.

Still looking, though. I know I have seen census data reprinted in DeBow's that listed, for example, the breakdown of specific types of baptist and other denominations across the U.S. I did numerous searches on Making of America and could not find it, though.

[styler]

Re: Mid-19th Century Religion

Try this link: 1860 Census data at UVA.